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From: tan@ihlpg.UUCP (Bill Tanenbaum)
Newsgroups: net.politics.theory
Subject: Re: Re: Health Care, Wonderful Market fo
Message-ID: <1231@ihlpg.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 12-Sep-85 13:59:00 EDT
Article-I.D.: ihlpg.1231
Posted: Thu Sep 12 13:59:00 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 13-Sep-85 04:29:58 EDT
References: <1764@psuvax1.UUCP> <10300@ucbvax.ARPA> <1774@psuvax1.UUCP> <10355@ucbvax.ARPA>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 33

> >[Piotr Berman]
> >The most general law is that the market has a tendency 
> >toward equilibrium: the demand stimulates the prices up, the supply
> >stimulates the prices down.  Increase of prices may stimulate the
> >production, decrease may stimulate removing marginal producers from
> >the market.  The real problem is that the equilibrium does not imply
> >superior fulfillment of social needs.
-------
> [Rick McGeer] 
> This is a common statement of leftwingers, and it is completely meaningless.
> What are "social needs"?  Who sets them?  Why are the demands met by the market
> not an adequate reflection of the generalized demands of society, if such
> things in fact exist?  And how do you propose to measure how well or badly
> any system of organizing society meets "social needs"?  When, or if, you
> can answer these questions, then we'll have something to talk about.  Until
> then, you're just flaming.
--------
Unbelievabe.  First, there is the unwarranted ad-hominem characterization
of Piotr Berman as a leftwinger, because he thinks there are social needs.
By that standard, even Ronald Reagan is a left-winger.
	Now, about "social needs".  How about starting with adequate food,
clothing and shelter for all?  Almost every non-libertarian would agree with
these.  Conservatives might stop there, liberals might add a few more, while
social democrats would add a lot more.  Who decides?  Why, the electorate,
through its elected representatives, of course.   Since social needs
are not defined in Libertarian economics, they clearly don't exist.
Right, Rick?
	Market demand may very well be an adequate reflection of the demands
of the society.  But my demand for food won't give me a supply in
Libertaria if I have no money and no job.  Guess I will have to hit you
over the head and steal yours.  Such is Libertaria.
-- 
Bill Tanenbaum - AT&T Bell Labs - Naperville IL  ihnp4!ihlpg!tan