Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/3/84; site teddy.UUCP
Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!harvard!talcott!panda!teddy!lkk
From: lkk@teddy.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: Re: Nicaraguan Parallel
Message-ID: <1303@teddy.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 13-Sep-85 11:44:27 EDT
Article-I.D.: teddy.1303
Posted: Fri Sep 13 11:44:27 1985
Date-Received: Thu, 19-Sep-85 00:15:17 EDT
References: <3900221@inmet.UUCP> <852@abnji.UUCP> <227@pyuxii.UUCP> <1291@teddy.UUCP> <233@pyuxii.UUCP>
Reply-To: lkk@teddy.UUCP (Larry K. Kolodney)
Organization: GenRad, Inc., Concord, Mass.
Lines: 81

In article <233@pyuxii.UUCP> tw8023@pyuxii.UUCP (T Wheeler) writes:
>Larry K., your'e not going to like this, but, you say you had
>to sing the songs, and I say you are a liar.

You're right, I don't like it, but coming from you TC, I don't expect any
better.
  
> The supreme court
>of the US, long before you were born, decided that issue.

What the supreme court decided (and what did they decide about patriotic songs
exactly?), is irrelevant to the point I was making.  De Facto requirements are
just as noxious as De Jure ones.  So I, as a second grader, had the right to
stand up in the middle of my class, and declare that I didn't beleive in
those songs and I wasn't going to sing them.  Right.  How many second graders
even have a notion of what such a move would entail/prove/whathaveyou?



>As
>to joining the scouts, that was YOUR problem, not anyone elses.

Didn't seem like a problem at the time.  I was gung-ho in favor of it.  But
then again, I was in 3rd grade and didn't know shit about what the implications
of it were.  The whole point is that elementary school children are the
quintessential passive victims.  You can get them to do anything, especially if
you are in a position of authority.  The same arguments convinced the Supreme
Court to eliminate prayer in the schools, even voluntary prayer.  Patriotic
indoctrination still remains.

>Further, we are not talking about the pioneers in the USSR, we
>are talking about Nicaragua.  Children there are indeed
>regimented wherever the government has a good stronghold.  If
>you cannot see the difference between totalitarian governments
>and our government, you indeed have a problem.



I didn't say there was no difference in the governments, just that they both
use similar methods in this instance.  There are, of course, many important
differences, and if you can get through the school/televison brainwashing
process with any amount of independent thought left in you, those differences
become significant.  But for the rest of the population...  (Who's worse off:
A typical resident of Bedford-Stuyvesant, Roxbury, Watts, Liberty City, etc.
or a typical resident of a Sandanista collective farm?)


>If you cannot see
>the difference between kids having to sing in what passes for music
>class in most schools and being forced to sing patriotic songs
>at the local tractor factory, your in deep trouble.

  
This wasn't music class.  It was a daily ritual, that went along with saluting
the flag.  And exactly which Sandinista tractor factory are you refering to.
Sounds like your confusing your boogiemen there.

>If you
>cannot see the difference between joining the scouts freely
>and being forced to participate in regimented indoctrination
>all the way through school (or getting no school at all), then
>you need real help. 

Please of great and all knowing TC.  PLEEEEEEASE.  HELP ME MEND MY WAYS.
PRAISE THE LORD!!!!

>
>Keep on Sporting Death, Larry.  When you become enlightened,
>let us know.  In the meantime, please spare us your party line
>remarks.
>T. C. Wheeler


I will keep on sporting death, thanks.  But I belong to no political parties.

-- 

Sport Death,
Larry Kolodney
(USENET) ...decvax!genrad!teddy!lkk
(INTERNET) lkk@mit-mc.arpa


Brought to you by Super Global Mega Corp .com