Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83 (MC840302); site enea.UUCP
Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!mcvax!enea!sommar
From: sommar@enea.UUCP (Erland Sommarskog)
Newsgroups: net.nlang
Subject: 2nd pers pron in different languages
Message-ID: <897@enea.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 19-Sep-85 18:40:08 EDT
Article-I.D.: enea.897
Posted: Thu Sep 19 18:40:08 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 25-Sep-85 07:45:30 EDT
References: <840@lll-crg.UUCP>
Reply-To: sommar@enea.UUCP (Erland Sommarskog)
Followup-To: net.nlang
Distribution: net
Organization: ENEA DATA, Sweden
Lines: 37

This little chart shows different pronouns used in some languages:

              2nd  singular                2nd plural
	     informal   formal            informal    formal
	      
Swedish        du         ni                 ni         ni
German         du         Sie                ihr        Sie
French         tu         vous               tu         vous
Italian        tu         La / voi           voi        voi / (Loro)

Some remarks:
1) Note the similarity between Italian and German. "Sie" actually
   means "she" or "they". "La" means "she" and "Loro" "they". 
   (In both languages beeing written lower case.)
2) I've been told "Loro" is rarely used these days. Italians
   on the net can correct me. Same about "La" vs. "voi". 
3) Swedish and French look similar too, but that's not the fact. 
   French probably displays the normal use. I.e using the plural
   form also in singular formal speech.
4) The special about Swedish is not *which* pronouns you use, but
   *when*. "du" is much more frequent and you normally use it when
   you talk to a stranger. Even the king has accept beeing called
   called "du" by journalists.
     The interesting fact is that this reflects a very rapid change
   which has ocurred the last 40 years.
     Many old people very much dislikes beeing entitled "du" by anyone
   they don't know. (For myself, I dislike beeing called "ni".)
   So, therefore you use "ni" when you speak/write to an anonymous
   community e.g. in commercials when you don't to harm people.
   (Also if you're talking to an old person and won't to be polite.)
   But if you only want to reach young people, you use "du"...
     A little problem is when Swedes go abroad. They continue with
   these habits. Saying "du" to a unknown German is almost an 
   insult, I'd guess. 
5) The Swedish pronouns are sometimes written "Du" and "Ni". "Du"
   could be seen as a form of formal speech. I dislike this habit
   quite much.


Brought to you by Super Global Mega Corp .com