Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site moncol.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!mhuxt!houxm!mtuxo!mtunh!vax135!petsd!moncol!ben From: ben@moncol.UUCP (Bennett Broder) Newsgroups: net.flame Subject: Re: Pet peeve: shoe and sock sizes Message-ID: <530@moncol.UUCP> Date: Mon, 14-Oct-85 16:54:36 EDT Article-I.D.: moncol.530 Posted: Mon Oct 14 16:54:36 1985 Date-Received: Tue, 15-Oct-85 20:39:45 EDT References: <212@pttesac.UUCP> Organization: Monmouth College, West Long Branch, NJ 07764 Lines: 98 >OK so lots of you are going to think I'm nuts but here goes anyway ... > >This is my first posting in net.flame . I have held this gripe in me >for years. Everyone I've ever complained to about this has thought I >was nuts. Maybe I am. It's not going to stop me from posting this >gripe to the world (even though it may apply only to the U.S.A.). > >My gripe is about ... you won't believe this ... > > [ *** SHOE and SOCK SIZES ***] > >How do you people know what size socks or shoes to buy? Try them on. That is why all shoe stores have chairs. And if you are able to find a competent shoe fitter (they are a dying breed, many shoe salesmen aren't fit to pump gas) he/she can help you decide whether a particular shoe fits. > What does >"size 8" mean? Has it ever been written down anywhere??? Why is >there a size for shoes and a size for socks? Do your feet change >size between the time they're naked to when they have socks on to >the time the have socks and shoes on?? Why is there a shoe size >for males and females and for male children and female children >and for babies. Is it written down somewhere what the different >sizes mean? As far as I know the answer is NO! And no one does >a god damn thing about it except laugh at those of us who complain! Many years ago, shoes were made by hand. A shoemaker would make all the appropriate measurements, then construct a shoe tailored to those measurements. The Army desired a faster way of getting combat boots to the troops, they devised a simple measuring scale using peppercorns. So a size 8 was eight peppercorns long. It was a simple scale and an inadequate one, but it stuck. Now, a manufacturer will make a range of lasts (measuring in inches in many critical dimensions), then try to fit the result into the unscientific scale that the shoe are sold by. So, shoes are made with one set of dimensions and sold by a different one. And unfortunately, the shoe industry is unlikely to do anything about it. If shoes were really sized in the manner they are made, there would be a proliferation of sizes. And shoe stores are much more profitable when they can *minimize* the number of sizes they have to carry. >Why can't it just be the dimensions of your feet? > >My foot size should be 25 by 9 centimeters or 9.8 by 3.6 inches. Really? Your feet are rectangular? And flat (two dimensional)? If one were to develop a scientific system, it would require at least 1) Length of foot from heel to ball of foot. 2) Length of foot from heel to end of toes. 3) Girth (not width!!) of foot at toes. 4) Girth at ball of foot. 5) Girth of instep. 6) Width of foot at ball. 7) Width of foot at heel. But imagine the proliferation of sizes. A shoe store would have a hard time carrying more than one or two styles, if they had to maintain such a large inventory. >OK, OK, OK, I know so maybe it's true that babies, children, >men and women all have different foot shapes. That's still >no excuse for being without a standard measuring scale. As far as >I know it's up to each manufacturer what size he wants >to call any particular shoe. I've even heard of shoe manufacturers >changing their shoe size scales to make buyers of their shoe >believe that their feet have become smaller! Aren't there any >laws on this? > >It bugs the sh*t out of me !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > >Marnix A. van Ammers Don't get so bent out of shape. It simply a matter of economics. If you want a shoe made to the specific dimensions of your foot, you can have a pair custom made for you. But in the real world, people want footwear they can afford. They want it in todays latest fashion. And they want it now!! So if we take as a given that shoes are going to be sold by one or two measurements, which seems to be a given in 'ready to wear' shoes, then the unscientific system is not too bad. It gives you and your shoe fitter a place to start, which is really all the industry intends it to be. Take your time, find a good shoe fitter, try lots of shoes on (don't consider your shoe size as gospel). With a little persistance you should be able to find a pair that fits. Ben Broder ..vax135!petsd!moncol!ben ..ihnp4!princeton!moncol!ben P.S. If you don't like the way shoes are sold now, realize that things are likely to get worse. The shoe industry has discovered that it can fit better than 70% of the population with medium width shoes. So it doesn't make economic sense for a manufacturer to produce different widths in his short-lived high fashion styles.