Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site emacs.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!gamma!epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!cca!emacs!joe From: joe@emacs.UUCP (Joe Chapman) Newsgroups: net.motss Subject: Re: Re: Thus saith the Lord Message-ID: <118@emacs.UUCP> Date: Fri, 15-Nov-85 16:26:47 EST Article-I.D.: emacs.118 Posted: Fri Nov 15 16:26:47 1985 Date-Received: Thu, 21-Nov-85 05:51:51 EST References: <1312@sphinx.UUCP><90100003@haddock.UUCP> Distribution: net Organization: Uniworks Inc., Wellesley, MA Lines: 55 <> Jim Campbell in <90100003@haddock.UUCP> on 14 Nov 85: > Now I am curious -- does the Bible ever make an explicit statement against > homosexuality in general, instead of just male homosexuality? I don't think so. It's difficult to say what the Bible says explicitly on any subject. Perhaps most of the difficulties are linguistic: the words and rhetorical elements don't translate well across a few milennia. Whether the blessed Apostle Paul would have approved of Quentin Crisp is an exercise in psychohistorical speculation; whether he would have described him to the holy Church in Rome with any of the words many allege he used to mean "homosexual" is unlikely. The passages which might be read as proscriptions of homosexuality fall into two general categories. The first includes the Levitical "abomination" (you shall not lie with a man as you lie with a woman) and St. Paul's "men leaving the natural use of the woman and burning in lust towards one another" passage. It would be hard to argue that these don't apply exclusively to males. The other category includes the anathematic laundry-lists of the New Testament ("neither x, nor y, nor z shall ever inherit the kingdom of heaven"). The words used here are "arsenokoitai" and "malakos". The former is difficult to translate precisely, but it's clearly based on the root "arseno-", which refers to males. The latter is usually translated "soft" or "effeminate"; given the circumstances, I don't think it was meant to be interpreted as referring to lesbians. Incidentally, "malakos" is an especially interesting word: it takes up at least a column of tiny type in Liddell & Scott's Greek Lexicon (the standard reference work). The Latin "mollis" (used in the Vulgate) isn't any clearer. One might reasonably expect that little attention would be paid to women's sexuality in writings of the period; it was certainly no less a phallocratic society than our own. Considering the Bible as a whole, very little attention is paid to anyone's sexuality. I hate to have to have to admit to my personal interest in the matter, but I think that the Father of an Infinite Majesty, His Honorable, True, and only Son, and the Holy Ghost, the Comforter, would find my sex life rather boring. [ This is my ten-minute homily on this topic, so the citations and references are off the top of my head. I'm an Anglican, not a fundamentalist, so I can't quote chapter and verse of anything but the Book of Common Prayer. The best general discussion of the scriptures and homosexuality can be found in John Boswell's "Christianity, Social Tolerance, and Homosexuality" (Univ. of Chicago), of which an excellent summary was posted to this newsgroup by rrizzo (I think) several months ago. ] -- Joe Chapman Dr. Prentice: "I couldn't commit the decvax!cca!emacs!joe act. I'm a heterosexual." joe@cca-unix.arpa Dr. Rance: "I wish you wouldn't use those Chaucerian words."