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From: martillo@mit-hector.UUCP (Yakim Martillo)
Newsgroups: net.politics,net.religion.jewish,net.nlang.india
Subject: Re: Middle East, Oil and the costs of Militarism
Message-ID: <141@mit-hector.UUCP>
Date: Sun, 17-Nov-85 09:31:17 EST
Article-I.D.: mit-hect.141
Posted: Sun Nov 17 09:31:17 1985
Date-Received: Tue, 19-Nov-85 01:47:17 EST
References: <460@mhuxm.UUCP> <740@whuxl.UUCP> <10822@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU>
Reply-To: martillo@mit-hector.UUCP (Yakim Martillo)
Organization: MIT Project Athena
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Xref: lsuc net.politics:2028 net.religion.jewish:1560 net.nlang.india:444

>> 
>> been or are under Islamic subjugation, might have some legitimate grievances
>> against the Islamic world and that they might have some legitimate claims
>> for compenstation for Islamic mistreatment.
>> 
>
>The following identity is FALSE :
>
>Muslim = Arab = Anti-semitic = Anti-israel
>
>However, it is conveniently used by political demagogues to
>further their own agenda.

Since I never made the equation, this particular reply is a particularly 
slimy attempt to avoid a legitimate issue.  A system like Islam may have
bad aspects.  In India for example caste and the suttee have been in the
past part of the system of Hinduism.  Criticism of such practices is 
legitimate.  

Calling criticism  of such practices  bigotry or illegtimate   is pure
intellectual cowardice or dishonesty.  Since most Muslims and Jews who
debate middle eastern issues constantly engage in intellectual dishonesty,
I am unsurprised that such intellectual dishonesty has resurfaced.

I personally have no interest in European Jewish Zionism and consider
it basically a wrong-headed and disgusting movement (although not nearly
as wrong-headed and disgusting as Arab Nationalism or Islamic 
Fundamentalism).

Once European Intellectuals had the courage to attack shibboleths and
oppose the crudities of, say, pre-Enlightenment Christianity.  
People like Hobbes, Lockes, Montesquiue, Rousseau, Voltaire, Montaigne etc.
demanded change.  I consider myself in this tradition.

There will be no peace in the Middle East until there are some fundamental
changes in Islamic attitudes, nor do Muslims have any right to claim
rights such as national self-determination until they show some ability
to live on terms of mutual respect and equality with the non-Muslim
minorities who live among them.