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From: friesen@psivax.UUCP (Stanley Friesen)
Newsgroups: net.politics.theory
Subject: Re: defining racism -- Laura on compassion
Message-ID: <914@psivax.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 18-Dec-85 18:10:43 EST
Article-I.D.: psivax.914
Posted: Wed Dec 18 18:10:43 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 20-Dec-85 21:54:22 EST
References: <167@ucbjade.BERKELEY.EDU> <260@gargoyle.UUCP> <2 <383@ubvax.UUCP> <336@l5.uucp>
Reply-To: friesen@psivax.UUCP (Stanley Friesen)
Organization: Pacesetter Systems Inc., Sylmar, CA
Lines: 80

In article <336@l5.uucp> laura@l5.UUCP (Laura Creighton) writes:
>
>>Unless we really want to get picky about cultural-religious connections,
>>I'd rather leave spiritual/moral superiority out of it.  Especially
>>since "racism" as it's commonly used happens to be an almost entirely
>>Christian disease.
>
>I beg to differ.  Pre-Christian south-east Asia, in any case was full of
>Japanese/Chinese  Chinese/Japanese and Everybody/Korean racism.  This
>much I know and I would be very surprised to find that racism is not
>universal.
>
	Was?!?! To my knowledge there is *still* considerable racial
prejudice in Asia, for instance in Taiwan(which I have some knowledge
of). And, I believe that Christianity is still very much a *minority*
religion there.

>>Maybe because this society
>>values personal understanding above social harmony and justice.  The
>>problem with that is it lets people with less compassion use people
>>who have more.  Seeing THAT leads to a decline in the compassion of
>>the rest of us.
>
>Holy Smokes, Batman, are you proposing social harmony and justice without
>compassion?  as if compassion is not a pre-requisite for both of these?
>I fear that we do not mean the same thing by any of these words then.

	Very likely, perhaps you could help each other out by giveing
your respective definitions of comapassion. Actually Laura's
definition of compassion seems to me to be essentially the same as the
the definition for "personal understanding", or at least they are very
closely related.
>
>>Unfortunately, this society again is one which encourages people to
>>dream they can do anything they want.  
>
>Come again?  This is one of the *virtues* of this society.  It is the
>people who believe that they can not dream and achieve who are the
>frustrated ones who go about trying to bludgeon everyone into their
>level of misery.  The dreamers are too busy trying to make their dreams
>a reality.
>
	I think you are again talking from different definitions.

>If we now build more fire-walls to protect Gays, are the Asians and
>the Mexicans next?  At some point we are going to have to give up
>kludges like protectivve legislation and try to fix the real problem
>of inexpressible hatred.  This one is going to be tough -- and I
>think that you must study compassion in oder to overcome hatred on
>a personal level.

	I think this is a very good idea, and it requires a lot of
public education.
>
>>It's useful to know what someone feels to the extent that one can
>>respond to it, without letting a compassionate attempt to understand
>>it cloud one's judgment.  
>
>Compassion does *not* cloud one's judgement.  Are you talking about
>fear of hurting other people here?  This isn't compassion.
>
	In fact I would say that "knowing what someone feels so that
one can respond to it" is a major component of what you, Laura, would
call compassion(am I right?) In that case the distinction that is
being drawn above is artificial. I certainly understand what you are saying
about compassion not necessarily clouding judgement.

>>Withholding compassion when you normally
>>give it out freely is a very powerful way to express your beliefs
>>about an issue.  
>
	Sounds rather manipulative and degrading to me. This sort of
stuff tends to get me rather irritated, or even down-right stubborn.

-- 

				Sarima (Stanley Friesen)

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