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From: piety@hplabsb.UUCP (Bob Piety)
Newsgroups: net.auto
Subject: Re: Help me fight unfair speeding ticket
Message-ID: <3269@hplabsb.UUCP>
Date: Mon, 10-Feb-86 12:04:49 EST
Article-I.D.: hplabsb.3269
Posted: Mon Feb 10 12:04:49 1986
Date-Received: Wed, 12-Feb-86 07:24:15 EST
References: <13200031@hpfcla.UUCP> <475@mmm.UUCP>
Organization: Hewlett Packard Labs, Palo Alto CA
Lines: 80

> In article <13200031@hpfcla.UUCP> ajs@hpfcla.UUCP writes:
> >In the past I've read with detached amusement various postings about
> >speeding tickets.  Now, after being branded a criminal on the way in to
> >work, it's suddenly all very real to me.  :-)
> >
> >Help!  I need information or pointers which might help me win in court
> >(in Colorado).  The circumstances are:  county road, a 1/2 mile section
> >with fields on both sides, no side roads at all, caught by radar doing
> >57 in a 45 zone.  Conditions clear, dry, with little traffic.  Previous
> >speed limit sign (45) was 3/4 mile back, before a housing area; the road
> >"opens up" after leaving that section, but there is a 45 limit on all
> >county roads unless otherwise posted.  Cop admitted to catching seven
> >people before me.
> >
> 
> So you knowingly and willingly violated the law and got caught.
> 
> >Do you have any sure-fire means to obviate the use of radar?  Or to
> >argue that I was doing a safe and reasonable speed for the time and
> >conditions?  How about the capricious nature of the speed trap?  And
> >if I lose in court, need I fear worse results than just paying the
> >ticket by mail?
> >
> 
> And now you want to weasel out of it.
> 
> >This really has my dander up.  I have a clean record (8+ years), a well
> >maintained vehicle, and am not a wild driver.  I even wear seat belts.  :-)
> >
> 
> Your poor dander! You must try and get it back down! Let's see - you are 
> indignant that you were accused of doing something that you did indeed
> do. Hmmm. I'd be pissed, too.
> 
> >Thanks in advance for any advice you can mail (or post if of general use).
> >
> >Alan Silverstein, Hewlett-Packard Fort Collins Systems Division, Colorado
> >{ihnp4 | hplabs}!hpfcla!ajs, 303-226-3800 x3053, N 40 31'31" W 105 00'43"
> 
> Jeeze! You WERE speeding. You KNEW you could get a ticket for it, but you
> did it anyway. Now perhaps it's time to grow up and accept responsibility
> for your actions. PAY UP! I am amazed by the number of people in America
> who just refuse to accept the consequences of their actions.
> 
> 	--MKR


There ARE times and places where a law, especially a speed law, is not really
justified.  Such situations are evident by the majority of drivers going 
above the posted limit.

A friend recently beat a similar ticket by demanding that a speed survey be
performed at the given stretch.  (Maybe they already had the data and merely
produced it for him.)  Apparently, a majority of drivers were driving at
about 35mph (in the posted 25, where he was doing 35) and thus the citation
was thrown out.

I don't know all the details, but I belive a traffic engineering report on
file listed the stretch as "safe for 35mph" and the majority of cars 
travelling at that speed nulified the ticket.  In other words, the low, 
25mph, speed limit was in question and was decided to be unjust.

Bottom line:  If you believe that most drivers exceed the limit on that
stretch, you may be able to follow similar procedures to prove that the
limit isn't justified.

Apparently MKR, above, would unquestioningly drive at any posted speed
without thinking twice-- even 25mph on a 6-lane straightaway.

Blatantly disregarding a law (fair or unfair) can cause you (and
possibly others) many problems, such as what you are dealing with now.
However, people should realize that not all laws are fair and just-- even
if they once were, due to circumstances at the time of enactment.
Thus, regardless of the outcome of your citation, you might want to take
the trouble to get the law changed; write letters, circulate petitions.
Unfair laws breed contempt for all laws and should be eliminated.

Good luck.

Bob