Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site gamma.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!gamma!tif From: tif@gamma.UUCP (Barbara Charles) Newsgroups: net.kids Subject: Small Children and Nightmares Message-ID: <770@gamma.UUCP> Date: Wed, 5-Feb-86 11:40:43 EST Article-I.D.: gamma.770 Posted: Wed Feb 5 11:40:43 1986 Date-Received: Thu, 6-Feb-86 20:50:07 EST Organization: BELLCORE, Livingston, NJ Lines: 287 Just got some other suggestions on "Small Children and Nightmares." It appears from the messages I'm getting - its a common occurrence at ages 4,5,6. That somehow disheartens me because that means my 3 year old is about due. Oh well, no one said it would be easy. I have posted some of the responses so that others having these problems can be helped too. If you response didn't get posted, please understand I am a new user and still learning how to use this thing. I appreciate ALL the help I received. Thanks again!! Barbara Charles ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >From bellcore!decvax!decwrl!pyramid!pesnta!hplabs!amdahl!bnrmtv!pats Fri Jan 31 19:10:40 1986 remote from gamma Received: by gamma.UUCP (4.12/4.7) id AA10113; Fri, 31 Jan 86 19:10:40 est Received: by decwrl.DEC.COM (4.22.01/4.7.34) id AA14056; Fri, 31 Jan 86 14:52:30 pst Received: by pyramid (4.12/3.14) id AA07592; Fri, 31 Jan 86 14:45:20 pst Received: by hplabs.ARPA ; Fri, 31 Jan 86 14:29:30 pst Received: by amdahl id AA20834; Fri, 31 Jan 86 12:56:50 PST Date: Fri, 31 Jan 86 12:21:27 PST From: gamma!bellcore!decvax!decwrl!pyramid!hplabs!amdahl!bnrmtv!pats (Pat Shriver) Received: by bnrmtv id AA14691; Fri, 31 Jan 86 12:21:27 PST Message-Id: <8601312021.AA14691@bnrmtv> To: hplabs!pesnta!pyramid!decwrl!decvax!bellcore!petrus!sabre!zeta!epsilon!gamma!tif Subject: Re: Small Children and Nightmares In-Reply-To: your article <765@gamma.UUCP> Status: RO Try the book "Solving Your Child's Sleep Problems" by Dr. Fumar (I think that is the author, I know it begins with an "F") It helped me to get my baby sleeping through the night in a relatively painless manner (no crying for 2 hours until she fell asleep). He also goes into sleep disorders and nightmares. The first couple of chapters are background on sleep, then you can go onto the chapters that most apply to your child. It is a great book that finally had some answers about sleep that no one else(family, friends, and the doctor) could answer. Pat Shriver BNR, Inc Mountain View, California -------------------------------------------------------------------------- My eldest (now ten) had this problem until about age 5. My 6 year old boy still frequently feels scared when going to sleep. I have no evidence at all except our intuitive feeling about our kids' well-being, but we are not concerned at all. I believe that being scared at night actually has something to do with mental growth -- I'm not going to be able to put this into words completely, but something along the lines of: as your mental (and spiritual if you like) faculties develop, your awareness of the world, of yourself, of your own increasing depth, and of your relationships grows. This is completely new and uncertain territory. Children don't know what's happening as their selves fill out; they seek for causes outside of themselves. The world appears strange because they are perceiving it with a new self. There, I knew I wouldn't do the idea justice. Sounds too much like a Rajneeshi advertisement. Anyway, in practical terms, as a way of perceiving a child's uncertainties it works just fine. What we actually do: On nights when our son appears particularly uncentered we avoid any scary stories. (We don't have a TV). We give him a full half-hour of bedtime wind-down, and as a last resort we sing. The singing is quite integrating for him. Works quite well as long as the parent is truly involved. -- Scott Brim swb@devvax.tn.cornell.edu Cornell University Theory Center {decvax,ihnp4,cmcl2,vax135}!cornell!swb 607-256-8686 swb@cornella.bitnet ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >From epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!umcp-cs!mark Sun Feb 6 01:28:16 206 Relay-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site gamma.UUCP Path: gamma!epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!umcp-cs!mark From: mark@umcp-cs.UUCP (Mark Weiser) Newsgroups: net.kids Subject: Re: Small Children and Nightmares Message-ID: <2939@umcp-cs.UUCP> Date: Thu, 30-Jan-86 02:17:51 EST Article-I.D.: umcp-cs.2939 Posted: Thu Jan 30 02:17:51 1986 Date-Received: Fri, 31-Jan-86 07:35:11 EST References: <2845@wateng.UUCP> <765@gamma.UUCP> Reply-To: mark@maryland.UUCP (Mark Weiser) Organization: U of Maryland, Computer Science Dept., College Park, MD Lines: 43 In article <765@gamma.UUCP> tif@gamma.UUCP writes: >I'm interested to know if any parents out there have small children you have >nightmares and are afraid to go to sleep at night. I have a 5 year old who >all of a sudden is afraid to go to sleep. Every night for about 2 weeks she >has been coming to get into bed with us. I'm all for the family bed ... > Both of our children went through this around age 4 or 5. The oldest, now 8, was over it by 6 or so. The youngest, now 4.5, is having it only mildly (so far). With ours both the symptom was manifested by lots of talking about how "I can sleep with my eyes open, Daddy. I don't have to shut my eyes, do I?". (funny that they both expressed it this way... something to do with our bedtime ritual I'm sure...) We too permit NO scary TV, including scary cartoons (no he-man or superheros, but even Donald Duck can be violent), but the world is in fact a violent place (if only via stamping ants) and so perhaps they pick it up by that age no matter what. My experience is that there are occasional intense days of fear, lasting a week or two, in which going to sleep needs to be extended with lots of back rubbing (our patent sleeping potion) and reassurance. In between there are longer periods of frequent sleeping nightmares (crying out in sleep) which if I wake up for I go in and again sit with the child (without waking them), stroke their hair, rub their back, etc. This seems to have an instant calming effect. Sometimes, and sometimes frequently, I don't wake up but find a child (only the youngest these days) in our bed in the morning. This is ok, and I'm guessing it will all pass like it did for the oldest. Best of luck. -mark Spoken: Mark Weiser ARPA: mark@maryland Phone: +1-301-454-7817 CSNet: mark@umcp-cs UUCP: {seismo,allegra}!umcp-cs!mark USPS: Computer Science Dept., University of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >From bellcore!decvax!decwrl!glacier!oliveb!tymix!adams Mon Feb 3 15:45:51 1986 remote from gamma Received: by gamma.UUCP (4.12/4.7) id AA26952; Mon, 3 Feb 86 15:45:51 est Received: by decwrl.DEC.COM (4.22.01/4.7.34) id AA01771; Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:23:10 pst Received: by glacier with Sendmail; Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:16:22 pst Received: by oliveb.ICO (4.12/4.7) id AA03375; Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:16:10 pst Posted-Date: Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:08:59 pst Received: by tymix.Tymnet (4.12/4.7) id AA07943; Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:08:59 pst Date: Mon, 3 Feb 86 09:08:59 pst From: gamma!bellcore!decvax!decwrl!glacier!oliveb!tymix!adams (Christina E. Adams) Message-Id: <8602031708.AA07943@tymix.Tymnet> To: oliveb!glacier!decwrl!decvax!bellcore!petrus!sabre!zeta!epsilon!gamma!tif Subject: Re: Small Children and Nightmares Newsgroups: net.kids In-Reply-To: <768@gamma.UUCP> References: <2845@wateng.UUCP> <765@gamma.UUCP>, <5908@cca.UUCP> Organization: Tymnet NTD, Cupertino CA Cc: Ah monsters! My specialty! When my daughter Jennifer was just a little guy she had monsters in her room that would come out when the lights were out. I decided that telling her that they didn't exist wasnot going to work, they are real to her. So, I went over to the cabinet under the sink and I pulled out a spray can of LYSOL. I said "Jennifer do you know what this is?" she said "No." I then proceeded to tell her that it was a can of 'monster repellent'. If you spray places that monsters usually hang out, they stay away cause they don't like the smell. This works fine if they cannot read or aren't familiar with lysol. You need to do something just as off the wall (and as real) as imaginary monsters. If she can read... A couple of years ago I saw a can of spray at the local toys are us. It was labeled simply 'Monster Repellent'. I could have been a millionare... (At least a hundredaire!). Anyway if you get into a ritual of spraying around her bed at night to "keep the monsters away from her dreams" and then again if she has the dream again, it just might be enough to change the pattern. Of course, this won't work if she's *really* upset about something else and the dreams are a symptom. I suspect this isn't always the case. GOOD LUCK! -Christie Adams {...sun!ios ...hplabs|fortune!oliveb}!tymix!adams ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >From bellcore!seismo!hao!cisden!john Mon Feb 3 20:58:18 1986 remote from gamma Received: by gamma.UUCP (4.12/4.7) id AA28950; Mon, 3 Feb 86 20:58:18 est Received: from hao.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV with UUCP; Mon, 3 Feb 86 19:19:02 EST Received: by hao.NCAR (4.12/4.7) id AA28949; Mon, 3 Feb 86 16:09:45 mst Received: by contel.uucp (2.2/SMI-2.2) id AA03977; Mon, 3 Feb 86 15:29:52 mst Date: Mon, 3 Feb 86 15:29:52 mst From: gamma!bellcore!seismo!hao!cisden!john (John Woolley) Message-Id: <8602032229.AA03977@contel.uucp> To: bellcore!petrus!sabre!zeta!epsilon!gamma!tif Subject: Re: Small Children and Nightmares Newsgroups: net.kids In-Reply-To: <765@gamma.UUCP> References: <2845@wateng.UUCP> Organization: ConTel Information Systems, Denver When I was about 4, I was waking up frequently with nightmares of animals trying to bite me. My dad helped me plant a garden of imaginary asparagus right next to the bed, with instructions to feed the asparagus to any hungry dream animals that came along. He reasoned that the imaginary animals ought to like the imaginary asparagus just fine, and wouldn't bother me after that. It worked. I have no idea if the same approach would work for anyone else, but I never had animal-nightmares again. -- Peace and Good!, Fr. John Woolley ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!ittatc!dcdwest!sdcsvax!sdcc3!sdcc6!loral!steve Sun Feb 6 01:28:16 206 Relay-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site gamma.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.3 alpha 4/15/85; site loral.UUCP Path: gamma!epsilon!zeta!sabre!petrus!bellcore!decvax!ittatc!dcdwest!sdcsvax!sdcc3!sdcc6!loral!steve From: steve@loral.UUCP (Stephen Newbegin) Newsgroups: net.kids Subject: Re: Small Children and Nightmares Message-ID: <1013@loral.UUCP> Date: Thu, 30-Jan-86 16:31:33 EST Article-I.D.: loral.1013 Posted: Thu Jan 30 16:31:33 1986 Date-Received: Sat, 1-Feb-86 08:52:50 EST References: <2845@wateng.UUCP> <765@gamma.UUCP> Reply-To: steve@loral.UUCP (Stephen Newbegin) Distribution: net Organization: Loral Instrumentation, San Diego Lines: 61 Summary: Yes, possibly a phase In article <765@gamma.UUCP> tif@gamma.UUCP (Barbara Charles) writes: >I'm interested to know if any parents out there have small children you have >nightmares and are afraid to go to sleep at night. I have a 5 year old who >all of a sudden is afraid to go to sleep. Every night for about 2 weeks she >has been coming to get into bed with us. >Is there anyone out there who has gone through this? Is there anything else >I can do to make her feel secure. Is this a passing phase that all children go >through. Thanks in advance for your help. > > Barbara Charles Before I had children of my own I would observe among friends children this same fearful stage beginning around 5 years old. I had theories that this was somehow attributed to the fear created when I child goes to school. It would then be reflected in the dream and sleep life. But now I have my own kids and I am going through this now with my 5 year old son. My son is home schooled and so has no outside fears or traumas. Formally he was fearless, independent, and could be alone for hours like presently his two year old sister, but now he has to have someone around(adult preferred) and will not go to sleep without one of his parents to sleep with. If one doesn't make too big a deal it appears all my friends kids had their fears fade away at 7 and 8 years. Now I have done a little thought as to why children go thru this fearful stage. Piaget theory has them going thru a very major change of consciousness at this time. Their perception of reality is changing(try reading some child developement stuff by Piaget). Ideas, thoughts, fears take on very real dimensions to the child. Not that they are not real, but they are physical and concrete to the child. Just like primitive people do strange rituals to ward off evil spirits, I have created our own family night time rituals. Only when mom has sung "Sleep my child" and dad has pronounced a unique prayer will he go to sleep in an instant. Of course dad is in bed with him and departs after he zaps out, but if he awakes he is welcomed back in bed with his parents. If I child senses evil I respect it because it is very real to him and have taught him how to avoid these forces within his mind by teaching him to be very aware of something real to him physically like his hand and the thoughts go away. I hope some of this has been of help because I am still exploring all this, but believe me its not a permanent thing. Keep giving them all your understanding, patience and love. A A A A -- ------------------------------- Steve Newbegin Loral Instrumentation San Diego sdcc6 ---\ gould9 --\ ihnp4 ---->-->!sdcc3 ---->--->!loral!steve (uucp) sdcrdcf -/ sdcsvax -/ At my farm I care not whether your a Communist Swine, a Facist Pig, or a Middle-of-the-Road Hog; your arguments must carry their own weight on my scales.