Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site frog.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!bellcore!decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!cybvax0!frog!wjr From: wjr@frog.UUCP (STella Calvert) Newsgroups: net.rec.nude Subject: What's wrong with sex? Message-ID: <638@frog.UUCP> Date: Sun, 9-Feb-86 22:37:58 EST Article-I.D.: frog.638 Posted: Sun Feb 9 22:37:58 1986 Date-Received: Fri, 14-Feb-86 03:30:57 EST References: <69@ubc-vision.UUCP> <389@tekigm2.UUCP> <609@amiga.amiga.UUCP> <460@hoptoad.uucp> <421@ubvax.UUCP> Reply-To: wjr@x.UUCP (STella Calvert) Organization: The Church of the Holy Starship Lines: 77 Keywords: porn? Summary: In article <421@ubvax.UUCP> sxnahm@ubvax.UUCP (Stephen Nahm) writes: >These soft-porn mags generally display women in unnatural poses designed to >cast the women as objects of lust for men. HUH? I rather thought they provided visual images as objects of lust for anyone. At least, never in my time of looking at heavily modified pictures that probably started with a female human model have I ever had someone burst into my house and demand that I stop lusting because I'm a woman. (Nor, in fact, have I had that problem when cruising the male nudes in mags oriented to gay men. "Stop looking, this isn't for the likes of YOU!") > Not only is this degrading to >women, but it propogates the concept that nude equals lewd. This nonsense again! Feh! By the time a picture is put into one of those airbrushed wondermags, it ain't a woman. This argument always reminds me of the folks who believe that taking your picture puts your soul in a box. I politely refrain from photographing such folks, but be damned if I'll refrain from snapping shots at others who don't share that superstition. Or looking at the photos when they're available. Or permitting folks to take pictures of me with my nakes hanging out iff they and I agree on the use of those photos. (BTW, Bill, I didn't offer to model for you because you'd probably find me over-abundant, as well as for geographic reasons. But if my bod matched the social norms for porn models, and our zipcodes had the first few digits in common, I'd have suggested a meeting for discussion, at least.) And in any case, the real problem is that there are a lot of folks trying to establish the idea that sexually stimulating is bad. Even though we all come from a long line of people who found each other stimulating. As someone, probably Lenny Bruce, said, "I like things that make me hot!" >pornography which degrades women should be discouraged. You've lost me. How can I be degraded by anything but my own actions? If I stopped naking not because I think it's too cold, or because I think it's not right for me, but because someone _else_ said it was wrong, THAT _would_ degrade me. But neither looking at, nor posing for, sexually enchanting photos degrades me. >It may help a few "nude prudes", but it will ultimately help you too. You >stated that you're a hedonist who happens to like nudity too. But if your >personal liberties are restricted by laws passed by people who have been >conditioned to associate nudity with offensive magazines, you won't be able >to enjoy your pleasures. How, pray tell, will rolling over for the immoral minority, and agreeing that sexually stimulating equals bad or offensive, protect my liberties? I like sex, I like naking around, I enjoy porn that matches my preferences, and I don't waste my limited social time with people so warped by xian propaganda that they think the flesh and urges god(s|dess|desses) created are dirty. (If SHe didn't like flesh, why did SHe make so jiggling much of it?) You say yourself that these folks have been conditioned to associate nudity with offensive (?) magazines -- why should I give them half of their claim by joining them in flaming sexy mags? With equal logic, I could argue that _they_ should go naked. (0=0) I've never joined a naturalist-oriented organization for this precise reason. Claiming that nudism is MORE wholesome than wearing clothes, while finding something offensive in the use of those parts not customarily exposed doesn't make sense to me. But it seems endemic in the nudist culture. I'd rather wait for another snowstorm that permits making x-rated snow angels, or visit my farming friends. STella Calvert Every man and every woman is a star. Guest on: ...!decvax!frog!wjr Life: Baltimore!AnnArbor!Smyrna! !SantaCruz!Berkeley!AnnArbor!Taxachusetts Future: ... (!L5!TheBelt!InterstellarSpace)