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Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!cbosgd!ulysses!allegra!alice!jj
From: jj@alice.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.news.group
Subject: New newsgroup proceedures, voting..
Message-ID: <5075@alice.uUCp>
Date: Tue, 4-Mar-86 08:41:46 EST
Article-I.D.: alice.5075
Posted: Tue Mar  4 08:41:46 1986
Date-Received: Wed, 5-Mar-86 05:39:52 EST
Organization: New Jersey State Farm for the Terminally Bewildered
Lines: 50

While in general I agree with Lauren's first point, that
voting makes sense one/site, I also fear that given the
inactivity of some sites, and the hostility  (or financial
condition) of others, renders this somewhat flawed as well.

As far as 'yes' votes being more likely, I disagree.  Given my
experiences on the net (I've suggested adding three new newsgroups
at one time or another), it's been my experience that there is
a dedicated cadre of about ~20 people who automatically vote 'no'
to any new group, regardless of (perceived) need.   From what
I've heard from other folks, it seems like this isn't limited
to my experience.   This seems to be to be a form of ballot
box stuffing, or perhaps just desire to make the network stop
evolving and eventually become extinct.  Since 8 of the 'no' votes
were form letters that didn't change ANY over the 8 months
in question, I think that this position is pretty well supported.
(I find the idea of a canned 'no' vote a bit repugnant, just as I would
find a canned 'yes' vote.  I haven't seen any canned 'yes' votes yet.)

I don't, unfortunately, have a good idea for how to add newsgroups.
IF the net was a collection of cooperating entities, perhaps
voting 1/site would work, but given the reactionaries and
such, I don't know how to ensure a 'fair' vote.  

In the past, I've argued for automatic newsgroup retirement,
with automatic restoration upon new traffic.  Several people
have picked up on this idea, but no one has yet written any
accepted software.

Currently Spaf serves this purpose, by watching the news statistics
and doing something when a group becomes terminally inactive.  This
is not only a lot of work for Gene, but also prone to drawing
fire from people who don't notice something until it bites them in the
leg.  Since I've drawn my share of net fire, I know just how unpleasant
this is. (It also tends to get rid of volunteers.)

In the past, USENET has been a co-operative venture, with volunteers
doing the work.  Given that the co-operative nature is rapidly
disappearing, we're going to have to find someone willing to do
the work, and also provide an INCENTIVE to do it, if it's going
to survive.  The problem of how to create a newsgroup, I suggest,
is merely secondary to the MAIN problem of what's wrong with the
net.

Enjoy it while it lasts, folks!
-- 
TEDDY BEARS HAVE LOTS OF PATIENCE, BUT THEY CAN FIGHT BACK!
"You're loosin' 'em, you're loosin' 'em, hold up your trousers  high!"

(ihnp4;allegra;research)!alice!jj