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From: cramer@sun.uucp (Sam Cramer)
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: Re: Israeli torture?
Message-ID: <3237@sun.uucp>
Date: Fri, 14-Feb-86 02:37:50 EST
Article-I.D.: sun.3237
Posted: Fri Feb 14 02:37:50 1986
Date-Received: Sat, 15-Feb-86 08:54:22 EST
References: <82@ubc-vision.UUCP> <3222@sun.uucp> <46@cad.UUCP>
Reply-To: cramer@sun.UUCP (Sam Cramer)
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 49

Raif Hijab says that I (and those of my ilk) are "the best example
of my mind is made up, don't confuse me with the facts" syndrome
and further I/we "repeat a lie often enough to themselves and others
that they end up believing it."  Well, I'll let the net.politics readership
decide who is repeating what lies.

Raif writes:

>2)  Early in the Carter administration, a vice consul at the
>    American Consulate in Jerusalem, Alexandra Johnson, uncovered
>    extensive torture reports while interviewing young Palestinian
>    student visa applicants to the U.S. She collected the data
>    and submitted a report to her superiors. Although initially
>    praised by Secretary of State Vance, she was later fired,
>    and ordered not to publish any of her findings.

Oops, forgot to tell the rest of the story.  It turns out that she was
suspected by the Israelis of supporting terrorist (undoubtedly a frame
by those devious Israelis, chimes the chorus) and was engaged to marry
one of the Arabs whose torture claims she reported.

In the wake of the charges a State Department report stated "Israel is a 
full-fledged democracy with extremely high standards of justice and human
rights".  But I guess we should instead believe the testimony of various
terrorists who are devoted to destroying the State of Israel (taking out
quite a few Americans in the process, BTW) rather than that of our Zionist
dominated State Department, right Raif?

He also quotes Felicia Langer.  As I have already pointed out, Ms. Langer 
is an Israeli Communist who often defends vicious terrorists.  The Israeli
Communist party, following the Moscow line, is of course opposed to the
state of Israel as presently constituted.  Quoting Langer on Israeli
affairs is like quoting Angela Davis on American affairs.  Neither are
particularly credible.

More relevant (and credible) evidence on the Israeli human rights
situation:  In 1979 Leo Navas, chairman of the American Bar Association's
UN committee toured Israeli jails, interviewing Arab prisoners.  He stated
"If you ask me, the Israelis are more indulgent over many issues concerned
with the rights of individuals than a number of democratic Western
countries I could name.  And that is without taking into account the
situation of war and terrorism that Israel has to deal with and the rest
do not."

Sam Cramer	Usenet:	{cbosgd,decwrl,hplabs,seismo,ucbvax}!sun!cramer
		Arpanet: cramer@sun.arpa
-- 

Sam Cramer	{cbosgd,decwrl,hplabs,seismo,ucbvax}!sun!cramer