Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.3 4.3bsd-beta 6/6/85; site amdcad.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!amdcad!phil From: phil@amdcad.UUCP (Phil Ngai) Newsgroups: net.singles Subject: Re: The "no is forever" doctrine Message-ID: <10177@amdcad.UUCP> Date: Mon, 3-Mar-86 01:39:29 EST Article-I.D.: amdcad.10177 Posted: Mon Mar 3 01:39:29 1986 Date-Received: Tue, 4-Mar-86 02:25:52 EST References: <167@axiom.UUCP> <1271@lll-crg.ARpA> <305@unirot.UUCP> <175@moncol.UUCP> Reply-To: phil@amdcad.UUCP (Phil Ngai) Organization: AMD, Sunnyvale, California Lines: 70 Keywords: beyond the initial rejection In article <175@moncol.UUCP> john@moncol.UUCP (John Ruschmeyer) writes: >>What does everyone else think? If you are told "no" the first time, >>do you give up? Once you break up with someone, is it over for >>good? Is "no" forever unless proven otherwise? > >As others have suggested, it really depends on the situation. The problem >is that there is almost no such thing as a "simple no". Rather, the no is >usually followed by some excuse (valid, lame, or otherwise). It is this >excuse that determines whether or no we will pursue the question again. I don't claim to be an expert but I've been using a method which seems to work nicely for me. Rather than call up someone and ask them to go out on a date, I call them up and talk to them, not necessarily in a "want to go out?" way. More like you would to your friends. For example, I might mention that I saw Amadeus and really loved it. That it made me want to see what real opera is like. If you're lucky, she'll either already have an interest in opera or be so enthralled by your description that she'll want to try it too. If she yawns, then talk about something else. But you haven't been rejected, you don't have to feel hurt and resentful. And once she indicates she is interested in going, you get to negotiate the day and time. None of this "I'm busy that day" stuff. She wants to go, she'll help you pick a day. Usually I make several calls of the "hi, how are you" type before we decide to go out together. But I think it's good because it gives you more time to get to know each other. And you're more likely to come up with something both of you really want to do. This assumes she is willing to talk to you over the phone like this and that you can find something to talk about. But if she weren't willing to talk to you I dare say she's not going to go out with you. And if you can't find something to talk about, you're probably not meant for each other. It can also be expensive ($10/hour in my case) but you don't have to chose someone far away and other factors (driving time) are likely to be more important anyway. > Me: Would you like to go out sometime? > Her: Yes, okay. > Me: Great. How about dinner and a movie? > Her: Well, I really don't have time these days as I have two > jobs and my position on the Presidential committee > investigating the Challenger disaster. > Me: Oh. Maybe some other time. I would probably respond that I'm a space freak and am fascinated by anything concerning it, particularly the Challenger disaster. And she could say the hearings aren't open to the public, or she could invite me to come. That wouldn't take up any of her time. But even in the worst case, you haven't been rejected and it will be much easier to keep trying to find activities of mutual interest. Pooh also asked "How do you feel about someone who is persistent after being refused?" It's happened to me twice. Both times it started out as flattering and then became a mild nuisance. After what seemed like a long time, it tapered off. In one case we remain very close friends. In the other case. I'll look her up after a few months and then remember why I don't see her more often. If the question is "is no in the context of a relationship forever?", I'd say in my experience it is. But you can be good friends, and you can never have too many of those. (but what do I know, I'm just an MIT nerd who plays with computers all the time) -- "We must welcome the future, remembering that soon it will become the present, and respect the past, knowing that once it was all that was humanly possible." Phil Ngai +1 408 749 5720 UUCP: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra}!amdcad!phil ARPA: amdcad!phil@decwrl.dec.com