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From: wfi@rti-sel.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.women,net.singles
Subject: Re: This, that, and the other thing.
Message-ID: <672@rti-sel.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 18-Feb-86 09:57:19 EST
Article-I.D.: rti-sel.672
Posted: Tue Feb 18 09:57:19 1986
Date-Received: Wed, 19-Feb-86 23:44:28 EST
References: <540@ism780c.UUCP> <659@rti-sel.UUCP> <1651@sphinx.UChicago.UUCP>
Reply-To: wfi@rti-sel.UUCP (William Ingogly)
Distribution: net
Organization: Research Triangle Institute, NC
Lines: 49
Xref: linus net.women:8708 net.singles:9317
Summary: 

In article <1651@sphinx.UChicago.UUCP> beth@sphinx.UUCP (JB) writes:

>>... What percentage of men on the beach would have
>>the decency to respond appropriately to the woman's request? Are you
>>implying SOME men act this way or MOST men act this way?
>
>If only one percent of men act this way, that means EVERY time a woman
>goes to a beach where there are more than 100 men, she can expect to
>be bothered.  Now you tell me: what percentage of the men on the beach
>do you think were repeatedly interrupted by people who refused to
>accept that their intrusion was unwelcome?  

If you go back and read my original posting and the posting it
responded to, you'll find that I was acting in the belief that the
original posting claimed that ALL men acted such and such a way. My
posting was a reaction  to what I perceived as an obnoxious attempt to
stereotype men by the actions of a subset of men (I've recently made
a posting to net.singles that contained a sentence whose content was
interpreted as racist by a fellow poster, and I was rightly notified
of this fact; now you tell ME why it's OK for feminists to stereotype 
men but not OK for whites to stereotype blacks or males to stereotype 
females...).

Oh, and by the way, I've been 'repeatedly interrupted' by people who
couldn't take NO for an answer many times in my life. And yes, in some
cases the interruption obviously had a sexual intent (and the
interrupter was female). I'm not saying women don't suffer this kind 
of harassment to a greater degree than men, just that all this talk
about those nasty men being this way and those bitchy women being that
way GETS US NOWHERE.

>The point is that it's an
>annoyance that *many* women have to deal with *because* they're women.
>(Although I hear rumors that it happens on male homosexual beaches as
>well.  Apparently a much higher percentage of men behave like this
>than women; and again, if only one percent of men act this way, ....)

A few questions:

So what are you suggesting? Are men incapable of change? How do you
propose getting to the one percent? Do you seriously think anything
will ever change 100% of the people? If a one percent _sshole-factor
isn't acceptable, what percentage is? What penalty do you think can
and should be imposed on males exhibiting this kind of behavior? How
can society as a whole work toward a reduction of obnoxious beach
behavior? How can females work toward a reduction? How can males (and
'by dying' is NOT an acceptable answer :-)?

                               -- Cheers, Bill Ingogly