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From: rb@ccivax.UUCP (rex ballard)
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: Re: Types of Property
Message-ID: <470@ccivax.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 12-Mar-86 18:02:53 EST
Article-I.D.: ccivax.470
Posted: Wed Mar 12 18:02:53 1986
Date-Received: Mon, 17-Mar-86 10:42:13 EST
References: <1691@bbncca.ARPA> <536@whuts.UUCP> <1636@ihlpg.UUCP>
Reply-To: rb@ccivax.UUCP (What's in a name ?)
Organization: CCI Telephony Systems Group,  Rochester NY
Lines: 60

In article <1589@brl-smoke.ARPA> wmartin@brl-smoke.ARPA (Will Martin ) writes:
>There are pretty obviously a number of types of property; I will list
>some below, as they come to me -- others may well think of still more
>types, or sub-divisions of these types, as this is by no means
>exhaustive. "Proper" or allowable or tolerable behavior may well be
>different on theses different types of property. (What is "proper" is,
>of course, determined by those with the greatest power -- usually those
>that have the guns. This usually equates to those controlling the police
>or army.)
>
>Public property: The traditional city street and sidewalks. Note that
>behavior on this is already restrained by ordinances regarding
>traffic-blocking, permits required to set up a stand and sell goods, etc.
>Municipal (public) funds pay to maintain these areas.
>
>Fully-public business property: The prime example is the mall, where all
>this discussion originated. This is NOT the individual store or shop in
>the mall, which falls under the preceeding category, but the area
>outside the stores, to which access is granted the general public, in
>the hope that they will in turn enter the stores to spend money. Note
>that there is no requirement or contract to the effect that, once you
>enter the mall, you *must* subsequently enter a mall shop to buy or
>browse or otherwise interact with the actual retailer; you have a legal
>right to enter this mall, even if it is private property, because it is
>held out as available for access by members of the general public. You
>can go and just sit, and it is legitimate. 
>
>In the light of the above, I would equate "public property" with the
>"fully-public business property", in that legitimate free-speech
>political actions should be allowed in both. Even though I probably
>would violently disagree with everything Tim would say or the leaflets
>he would distribute, I agree with him that access to this sort of area
>should be allowed, despite that some person or organization happens to
>own it.

Unless you propose using tax money to pay for the support and maintenance
of the mall (rather than charging the stores rent), the stores and
the mall management (acting on behalf of the owner) are the only ones
who have a legitimate "right" to determine what can and cannot be done
in the mall.  In fact, when malls became a gathering place for teen-age
gangs, the police were called in to eject them, even though they were
not patronizing the store.

If Tim really wants to distribute leaflets on the mall, he can approach
a few of the merchants, show them what he wants to distribute, and
ask the merchant to bring it up at the next "tenants meeting".
Charities and non-profit organizations frequently do this, and are
given permission to leaflet for a specific period of time.  For example:
Easter Seals can have various fund raising events during the week or two
preceding the telethon.  Ecology groups and the forest service people are
invited during RV exibition week.

The main concern of mall management is control of any activity which
might be percieved by the tenants as driving customers away.  If
you can convince the tenants that your activities will ATTRACT
people to the mall, you might be able to get the whole mall for
a 'Theme exibit'.  Also, find out what the themes will be, and
who is running them.  You may be able to get a booth and distribute
leaflets from there.  From the original posting, it sounds like
you were ejected because you didn't go through channels.