Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!harvard!husc6!panda!genrad!mit-eddie!mit-trillian!martillo From: martillo@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU (Yakim Martillo) Newsgroups: net.followup,net.politics Subject: Re: Air raid on Libya Message-ID: <395@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU> Date: Sat, 3-May-86 17:52:48 EDT Article-I.D.: mit-tril.395 Posted: Sat May 3 17:52:48 1986 Date-Received: Thu, 8-May-86 04:13:51 EDT References: <170@westpt.UUCP> <289@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU> <2094@psuvax1.UUCP> <501@bu-cs.UUCP> <2119@psuvax1.UUCP> Reply-To: martillo@trillian.UUCP (Yakim Martillo) Distribution: net Organization: MIT, Project Athena, Cambridge, MA Lines: 88 Xref: linus net.followup:5193 net.politics:14804 In article <2119@psuvax1.UUCP> berman@psuvax1.UUCP (Piotr Berman) writes: >> In article <2094@psuvax1.UUCP> berman@psuvax1.UUCP writes: >> >> Joachim Carlo Santos Martillo Ajami >> >A question: does anyone know a worse slime than Joachim Carlo Santos >> >Martillo Ajami? Martillo, I am against cencorship, but I promise you >> >$20 if you shut up. (The price is open to negotiation.) >> >Piotr Berman >> Personal attack should be kept out of the net. If you want to contribute >> something, please do, else keep it in E-mail. >> David Matthew Lyle >> Boston University >> dml@bu-cs.CSNET >> dml@buenga.BITNET >I did not wrote 'Joachim Carlo Santos Martillo Ajami'. >This is a signature, put under a posting in which said individual >was explaining a German netter that his place is in SA. I happen to have studied Weimar. Bormann's attitude in his inability to make ethical distinction was quite typical of extremist attitudes in Weimar Germany and was quite common among those who joined the SA especially the leftist-leaning members like Otto and Gregor Strasser. >I think that it was extremally low attack by Martillo, and sadly, >very characteristic for this individual. Borman was trying to incite disgust at Reagan in a rather low fashion and deserved an attact to the point. >Some time ago there was a discussion whether certain individual >should not be discuraged to post, since he espoused hatred to Jews >and many others. Martillo on the other hand keeps ranting against >muslim ('should be supressed', 'deserve to be treated like shit' etc.) >and now equates a German with a Nazi. I think people who cannot distinguish between bigotry and hatred of bigotry should be discouraged from posting. >I do not know how is it in USA, but in my country it is the gravest >of insults. Therefore I am appaled that while some bigots are shunned, >others are condoned. Martillo should apologize to Bormann, but knowing >his style of thinking I know that he will never do. Just out of curiosity, to which wonderful country are you referring. BTW, I rephrased my criticism of Bormann in response to another article. >I did not send E-mail to Martillo because I think that it is a valid >matter for this net. How shall we accomodate hateful fanatics here? >By patting them on the back and saying: nicely written, isn't it? >Bigotry is the worst illness of a society, and I have some little >experience of my own. Martillo is well read, intelligent and hateful. >He looks everywhere and sees only reflections of his own hate. >In a sence, he is explaing us what is the way a person like Kaddafi >may think. I think it is important not to be nice to hateful bigots. >They shouldn't be respected. Otherwise they can spread the poison. I agree bigotry is the worst illness of a society. For this reason I attack Islamic bigotry. I guess anyone who does not agree with Berman's leftist orthodoxy is hateful. I invite Berman to study Arabic and Islam and on the basis of some knowledge convince me I am wrong. He should probably also go live in a Muslim country for long enough that the Muslims forget he is not one of the local non-Muslims. Unlike Berman, a large part of my family and my fiance grew up in Muslim countries. My attitudes are much kinder. We have a basic philosophical difference. I am not a relativist. Some practices are simply wrong. Some cultures contain too much evil to be permitted to exist. Nazism was such a culture. Others must change because of the evil they contain. South Africa and Islam represent such cultures. Either Berman tells me constructive criticism of a culture is not permissible because all have equal validity or he is telling me only criticism of specific cultures by some criterion of leftist orthodoxy is allowed. The first possibility is ethically unacceptable because then I cannot criticize apartheid. The second is Stalinist. In either case, I think Berman should rethink his position before posting any more articles to the net.