Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!mit-eddie!think!harvard!seismo!mcvax!unido!ecrcvax!snoopy From: snoopy@ecrcvax.UUCP (Sebastian Snoopy Schmitz) Newsgroups: net.rumor,net.news.adm Subject: Re: Reading other people's mail Message-ID: <224@ecrcvax.UUCP> Date: Thu, 24-Apr-86 07:44:56 EDT Article-I.D.: ecrcvax.224 Posted: Thu Apr 24 07:44:56 1986 Date-Received: Sun, 27-Apr-86 06:44:32 EDT Organization: ECRC, D-8000 Muenchen 81, W. Germany Lines: 116 Xref: watmath net.rumor:2076 net.news.adm:652 Summary: Expires: References: <703@frog.UUCP> <12400018@uiucdcs> <2410@jhunix.UUCP> <168@proper.UUCP> <132@fai.UUCP> <11414@amdcad.UUCP> Sender: Reply-To: snoopy@ecrcvax.UUCP (Sebastian Snoopy Schmitz) Followup-To: Distribution: Organization: European Computer-Industry Research Centre, Munchen, W. Germany Keywords: In article jam@comp.lancs.ac.uk (John A. Mariani) writes: >I think some people are making a fundamental equation which just >doesn't hold up; > >e-mail == ordinary paper mail (or snail mail!) > >Perhaps a better equation would be > >e-mail == telephone communication Both equations are the same really ! I have to disagree on a legal point. Here in Germany (the Germans have a law for just about every aspect of life - this may be good or bad depending on your pov). As soon as something is transmitted via a post office controlled carier (post, telephone, packet switched networks etc. are all controlled by the Post Office Ministry here, i.e. part of the state) it is immediately subject to the Postal Secrecy Law. This means that no one is allowed to look at the message, open the envelope, tap the telephone etc. Most Usenet mail gets transmitted over telephone lines and therefore underlies this restriction. The agreement postal administrations have amongst each other is that they ensure that they will ensure this integrity for international mail (i.e. the German post will rely that the American post will not oipen my letter, before it reaches its destination). This may mean that different rules apply for mail items originating in deifferent countries. Let me ask for some restraint in this matter. (I don't want to sound like Gene Spafford, but...) There are two opinions. One says "Snarl, Snarl", if you're so dumb to send mail through my machine, I will read it. This is an intentional breach of other peoples privacy (there are several users out there who don't know that you do this). I am sometimes really bewildered about some of the startling naivite' displayed by some of our American fellows. Just because you are libving in a "free" country, does not mean that you can take the freedom to mess around in his/her personal life. The attitude: "This machine's mine and I can do with it whatever I want" is insanely selfish and reflects little concern for the privacy requirements. The other opinion is to say "Snarl, snarl", the guy who reads mail is an a**hole ( I am inclined to agree ) and should not do this. Both points are extreme. I believe that there should be a workable compromise. If you forward mail, then don't read it - you may get legal hassles. Would you like AT&T to sue you, for compromising their phones into comitting a security breach for which the US govt may sue them for breach of postal regulations. If mail bounces back and you want to help it along, then do so, but don't look at the contents. This can be done, you know. Headers these days fill about a screen and so you get little other information. One cannot trust a computer system (due to bugs etc.) but the administrators should be trustworthy. I point out to every user that I can read his mail, but that I do not do so, because I respect his/her privacy. I do tell them that mails may fail and that I sometimes cannot help seeing it. We have several people here, who transmit mail to their lovers/wives/husbands on other machines. I'll be damned if I ever look at any intimate mail of theirs. I have no business with that. I want my users to feel safe and at home on my system. I tend to trust USENet a lot - I install most software from the Net without ever really looking at it. I think that most SA's do. Look at the uproar caused by the guy with the nasty shar. The fact that the shar did something nasty probably wasn't what upset everyone. I think it was the principle that someone had basically compromised the spirit of free & easy cooperation and implicit trust of the Net, that got people annoyed. I think that this is a very good reason to be annoyed. Once the trust is gone, the net will die slowly - to due a malignant node. My modus operandi is as follows: I think carefully, before I "do" something, "What would I feel like if someone did this to me or my mail ?". That settles most of my questions. Sorry about the length. I hope I have contributed a useful point of view. Love, Seb BTW Is there a feature of rn that will keep a copy of my outgoing messages into the net for me ? (like the mail "record" facility ?) -- There are three types of people: - those who make things happen - those who watch things happening - and those who wonder what happened ...\!mcvax\!unido\!ecrcvax\!snoopy /* N.B. valid csh address */