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From: bblue@crash.UUCP (Bill Blue)
Newsgroups: net.micro,net.micro.ns32k
Subject: Re: Symmetrics s375
Message-ID: <111@crash.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 1-Jul-86 19:36:47 EDT
Article-I.D.: crash.111
Posted: Tue Jul  1 19:36:47 1986
Date-Received: Wed, 2-Jul-86 06:47:20 EDT
References: <1322@brl-smoke.ARPA> <105@vixie.UUCP>
Reply-To: bblue@crash.UUCP (System)
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Xref: dcdwest net.micro:10492 net.micro.ns32k:40

I also have an s/375 and have some additional comments to Paul's.

Let me preface this by saying that in general, I am pleased with the
machine.  Like Paul, I feel there could be a number of improvements,
many of which are 'promised'.

Mine's the version without ethernet, but with 2mb ram and an 86mb Toshiba
drive internal.

As I said above, I like the machine, but I am not very pleased with 
the company.  Yes, I know they are small and are trying hard.  But
internal company problems and changes should not project negatively
toward the customer.  When I received the machine there were a lot of
problems. The filesystem had been installed incorrectly, among other
things.  It took me over a week of reporting bizarre problems (which of
course, had to be something I'm doing wrong) for them to come to the
conclusion that it may be *their* fault.  Machine had to go back.  About
a week later I got it back and most all of the problems had been taken
care of.  Fine, but what about those remaining?  I found out that many
of them were already known and would be taken care of in the final
software release in July.  Ok, I'll go with that (not that there was any
choice).  I was also informed that I was taking up far too much of their
time, and that they had spent too much time on my problems already!  Oh,
REALLY?  MY problems?  Indeed.  What about all of MY TIME that was wasted
on THEIR PROBLEMS?  This is a preposterous attitude, which hopefully, is
not representative of the entire company, but rather one or two
individuals.

I originally ordered my machine in late April (I got lots of attention
until after the order was shipped, by the way).  But I was also promised
the full Unix manual set, itemized in the user agreement that I was
required to sign, as an item that I would receive in two to three
weeks.  After more than a month, I called to find out where the manuals
were.  Interesting.  Between the time I received my machine and the time
I called, there had been a policy change and manuals were no longer
being provided with the non-ethernet version. That's fine, but why
should that affect MY order?  I was told by several people prior to
giving the order that manuals were included, and my documentation so
states.  Now they're saying that if I want the manuals, it'll cost me
another $150!  Unethical?  You bet.

Other observations/extensions to Paul's thorough comments on the machine:

Compiler:  Painfully slow.  Actually, it's the loader that's the prime
culprit, the compiler/assembler seem reasonable, but probably will be
better in next release.  The loader *has* to be.

Clock:  Software timekeeping loses two minutes per day.  Backup clock
loses about two minutes per week (on mine).  Software timekeeping is so
slow that I had to put a hardware to software update (date `rtc`) in
crontab so the system would be reasonably close.

Speed:  Not bad, overall.  Pretty peppy at times.  But incoming data via
uucp just kills it, especially at 2400bps.  They say it should hardly
matter much, but it does - a lot.  In fact, the loader times more than
double during incoming uucp data at 1200bps.  I don't think that's the
way it should be but of course, it must be something *I'm* doing wrong.

System upgrade in July:  Really looking forward to that, EXCEPT that the
machine MUST be sent to them for it.  It involves a complete reformat
and reinstall, from the ground up.  That means that the multitudes of
hours that may be invested in your current operations (all the fine
tuning, support files, config files, news files, user accounts and
directories, etc etc) are going to have to be completely rebuilt,
selectively, from backups.  That's a major pain - not to mention time
offline if your unit happens to be in a 'responsible' position to other
sites, which mine is.  I *wish* there was another way.

The BSD being supplied in July is supposed to have Chris Torek's
dial-in/dial-out mods to the kernel so you don't have to dedicate
certain ports to dial-in operation only, and others to dial-out
operation only.  That will be a real plus.  In fact, one of my decisions
to buy this unit was based on that mod being available.  Also support
for reading/writing MSDOS format disks may make it too.

Noise:  My system is very quiet and runs very cool.  The drive is
a little noisy when it seeks, but it's not objectionable to me. 
Practically no fan noise.

I think the overall hardware box is pretty well thought out and
engineered, and as Paul observed, obviously done by competant people.
Unfortunately, they definitely lack finesse when it comes to business
practices.  It's this deficiency that has bitten a number of well
intending small companies.  Many of which are no longer with us.

A semi-pleased-but-somewhat-disappointed customer,

--Bill Blue	{ihnp4, akgua, sdcsvax, noscvax}!crash!bblue