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From: chongo@amdahl.UUCP (Landon Curt Noll)
Newsgroups: net.micro.ns32k
Subject: Re: Query: Symmetric 375 computer
Message-ID: <3676@amdahl.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 12-Sep-86 21:30:10 EDT
Article-I.D.: amdahl.3676
Posted: Fri Sep 12 21:30:10 1986
Date-Received: Fri, 12-Sep-86 22:58:28 EDT
References: <174@grpthry.UUCP> <537@rna.UUCP>
Reply-To: chongo@amdahl.UUCP (Landon Curt Noll)
Distribution: net
Organization: Amdahl Coup, UTS Products Hen house
Lines: 46

In article <537@rna.UUCP> dan@rna.UUCP (Dan Ts'o) writes:
 >In article <174@grpthry.UUCP> ylh@grpthry.UUCP ( ylh ) writes:
 >	Why do you think it is poor for a 32016. That level is about what
 >I would expect for average UNIX utilities. For 32-bit and VM stuff, the 32012
 >should do better. But the 11/73 is a pretty fast machine, many operations on
 >a 11/72 are as fast or faster than an VAX 11/750, which is approximately the
 >level of performance I'd expect from both 68010 and 32016 machines (at 8 to
 >10Mhz). Especially with a relatively slow disk.
 >	In addition a comparatively configured 11/73 would be about $10000,
 >including Ultrix.

One thing you should look at is a Symmetric with a better disk.  They sell
drives with an ave. seek time of 27 ms.  The 50 mb drive is the slowest
drive they sell. 

Another thing to keep in mind is which version of the Unix you looked at.
If it was an older version of 4.2, then it was likely something which came
from Old-Genix land.  Under Genix 4.1 the language tools were MEGA-MEGA
BOGUS, SLOW and POOR code generators.  It is a credit that the Symmetric
did as well as it did with that stuff.

Symmetric has a new set of language tools.  They produce good-old BSD a.out
(not Genix strangeo a.out) as well.  They have, or will have soon 4.3BSD
which has a number of performance improvements over 4.2BSD.  Symmetric
did a bunch of in-house tuneups as well.  These language tools provide
a good performance upgrade over the old tools.

Another speed factor can be the chip set.  Old NS32000 chip sets were;
well "i signed the form saying I can say".  The chips that are
being shipped today, even though they are at the same clock speed (10 Mhz)
work faster because the compiler does not have to do "funny-things"...

I have heard rumors of 8mb systems, but I don't know when or how many $'s.

All these factors can play into how much performance you will see
out of a 375 box.

 >	The real competition, I believe, is a PC AT (at 8-12 Mhz) running
 >Xenix, which one can also find for about $5000. A PC AT running Xenix can also
 >perform close to a VAX 11/750. No VM, though.

I have seen a Symmetric out perform a PC AT/Xenix system.

chongo <> /\oo/\
-- 
	    [people at Amdahl Corp never say things like this]