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From: stuart@BMS-AT.UUCP (Stuart D. Gathman)
Newsgroups: talk.origins,talk.religion.misc
Subject: Creation, Evolution, and Flood
Message-ID: <203@BMS-AT.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 11-Sep-86 19:11:27 EDT
Article-I.D.: BMS-AT.203
Posted: Thu Sep 11 19:11:27 1986
Date-Received: Mon, 15-Sep-86 02:48:26 EDT
Organization: Business Management Systems, Inc., Fairfax, VA
Lines: 74
Keywords: science flood cosmology
Xref: linus talk.origins:31 talk.religion.misc:44

Actually, I don't assume evolution is not part of God's plan.  I don't
pretend to have been around when God created the world.  I am convinced
that it happened just the way the Bible describes it.  I get ticked
off at both creationists and evolutionists because of the irrational
basis of both theories.  

Evolutionist:	The only alternative to evolution is special creation.
	Since God doesn't exist, this is clearly impossible.  Therefore
	evolution is true.  (Despite the evidence.)

Creationist:	Evolution was conceived by heathen, therefore it could
	not possibly be Biblical (i.e. true).  (No science required.)

The waters are further muddied by the 'apparent age' problem which
makes any scientific consideration of creation impossible.  (Science
is only concerned with what we can observe.)

My conclusion: both creationism and evolution are totally unscientific
and should not be taught in science classes.  (I mean general evolution.
Specific evolution is well proven.)  Perhaps 'cosmology' would be an
appropriate name for the subject.

I think a subject more approachable from the scientific view is the
Noahic flood.  Let's have some discussion on the net about the Flood.

Here are some facts from the Bible

Duration:	40 days of rain.  The earth covered by water for more
	than a year.

Onset:		Sudden.  Only the seven in the Ark had (100 years worth
	of supernatural) warning.

Water source:	the 'floodgates of heaven' and the 'fountains of the deep'.
	(The objection that there is not enough water in the atmosphere
	and polar caps is not sufficient.)

Consequences:	the flood caused profound changes in the earth's ecology.

	Before:		It never rained until the flood.  The earth was
			watered by a mist from the ground.
			Average human lifespan was 900+ years.
			There were no seasons.

	After:		Rain was a regular event; rainbows were seen.
			Typical human lifespan dropped quickly to 120+ years.
			Between Moses and David lifspan dropped further to
			70 years.
			Seasons took hold.
			Eating meat was condoned by God.

Thoughts:

	Did the flood split the super continent in a year?  (As opposed
		to millions of years.)

	When did the flood take place?

	Changes in lifespan and weather indicate to me that radiation
		based dating would be totally off base for events
		prior to the flood.  (I.e. carbon 14).

	Evidently, some species were able to survive the flood without
		being in the Ark.  (E.g. insect eggs, fish eggs, plants,  etc.)
		The Bible says that everything that breathed died (Gen 7:22).
		Only breathing creatures were in the Ark (Gen 7:15).

	Was the flood the demise of dinosaurs?  (They were too big
		to fit in the Ark?)

	What kind of sediment layers (mixed with creatures) would the
		flood produce?
-- 
Stuart D. Gathman	<..!seismo!{vrdxhq|dgis}!BMS-AT!stuart>