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From: daver@felix.UUCP (Dave Richards)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,net.legal
Subject: Re: Re: Commission on Pornography -- reply to GWSmith
Message-ID: <1597@felix.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 24-Sep-86 21:44:47 EDT
Article-I.D.: felix.1597
Posted: Wed Sep 24 21:44:47 1986
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Reply-To: daver@felix.UUCP (Dave Richards)
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 mat@mtx5a.UUCP (m.terribile) writes:
>
[regarding age of porn film actors]
>First of all, in New York State, the age limit is 16, not 18.  A little too
>young.  Secondly, it is claimed that in making films for certain audiences,
>*not* pedophilic in the usual sense, there is a great deal of pressure to
>use women (and men) who are younger.  Because of loose recordkeeping require-
>ments and because the ``stars'' are usually paid in cash, it's hard for the
>State labor authorities or child welfare authorities to keep tabs on this
>properly.

I'm not sure that this is a valid reason for preventing these willing people
from working.  Just because it may be difficult for the government to stick
their nose into something, does not mean it should be made illegal.
Example:  It is hard to keep track of people who wander around the country
and have no permanent address.  Should we outlaw this, and throw nomads (or
gypsies, or whatever you want to call them) in jail?

>> [regarding porn magazines as opposed to "outdoor" type magazines] 
>> >On the other hand, legitimate sports publications stress safety measures and
>> >risks, and report deaths and injuries that occur.  They are dedicated to the
>> >welfare of their subscribers (thereby keeping *live* subscribers) rather than
>> >dedicated to the *addiction* of their subscribers (thereby sucking more in).
 
>> In more than one of the "skin" magazines I have read, there are write-in sec-
>> tions that DO answer questions, address disease protection and so forth, dispel-
>> ling myths and performing a definite educational function.  Some of the most
>> comprehensive articles about "safe sex" (regarding AIDS) that I have seen ap-
>> peared in Hustler magazine.  
>
>And to the extent that these things are done, and to the extent that the
>advice is sound (my guess is that it is) the publications are serving a
>useful purpose to their subscribers.  But not all the remarks are directed
>at Hustler (although some may be) and not all the remarks are directed at
>magazines.  What about the ``XXX Sex Dreams of a Sorority Girl XXX'' (the
>name is one I just made up, folks ...) films that get run in the ``adult
>theaters''.  Do they have write-in sections on sex with medically sound
>advice?

As can be seen by the quote I included, I was responding to the comparison of
porn MAGAZINES with "outdoors" or "sports" MAGAZINES.  If you want to change
the subject to films, fine, but obviously what I said has no bearing on this.

[description of porn as having pictures of people being tortured, nipples or
penises pierced, etc.]

>> This is not what I think of when I think of pornography.  I have not been ex-
>> posed to this type of material, although I'm sure it exists for those willing
>> to spend the effort to find it. 

>....... one of the few types of direct research that the Commission *did*
>undertake was a survey of materials available at ``adult bookstores''.  The
>methods included taking the title of every nth current magazine or book that
>had any sexual reference on the cover.  Various materials were also purchase,
>and other materials siezed by law enforcement officials were provided.

Unfortunately, that type of survey ("every nth current") does not say much 
about the relative volume, or popularity of each type of pornography avail-
able.  Using the same survey technique in a supermarket, one could infer
that a person is just as likely to buy a bottle of tabasco sauce as they 
are to buy a potato, because they are both equally available.  The false
conclusion is that the demand for all items is equal. 
 
Obviously I'm guessing here, but I would imagine that the largest volume of
porn is that which is in Penthouse, Playboy, Playgirl, and so forth, simply
because of the multitude of convenience stores that sell them.  So who can
really say what PERCENTAGE of porn sold is of the violent, sadomasochistic
or torture type.  Let's say that this 'violent' porn amounts to 1/100 of
the total pornography market.  I don't think that is cause for concern.
Of course it may be more.  Did the commission examine that issue?  Or did
they merely say that 'some exists'? 

Dave

>Mark Terribile

>>Dave