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From: martillo@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU (Yakim Martillo)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Frenchmen getting bombed, why them?
Message-ID: <1230@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU>
Date: Sun, 5-Oct-86 14:46:24 EDT
Article-I.D.: mit-tril.1230
Posted: Sun Oct  5 14:46:24 1986
Date-Received: Sat, 11-Oct-86 10:21:19 EDT
References: <7206@sri-spam.ARPA> <1063@ucbcad.BERKELEY.EDU>
Reply-To: martillo@trillian.UUCP (Yakim Martillo)
Organization: MIT Project Athena
Lines: 65

In article <1068@ucbcad.BERKELEY.EDU> hijab@cad.Berkeley.EDU.UUCP (Raif Hijab) writes:
>Summary:Of terrorists and Freedom Fighters

>In article <2001@homxb.UUCP> sdu@homxb.UUCP (S.USISKIN) writes:
>>For example, when the Isrealis catch a terrorist, they
>>bulldoze his family's home.  People then fear for their family,
>>even if they don't fear for themselves.  
>>Not that I think reprisals really do any good, but thats the theory
>>behind it.  Actually, I think reprisals, even if they work, are on
>>morally shaky ground.  Its like sinking down to their level.

>I truly appreciate Suzanne U.'s remark about the shaky moral ground
>for Israel's actions in the occupied territories. Still I have to
>question why a people opposing a brutal occupation are terrorists,
>when World War II fighters in the French Resistance were considered
>heroes. The double standard makes me sick. 

The moral ground is not shaky at all.  Muslims have the obligation
from the Qur'an to humiliate and degrade dhimmis.  Often Muslims have
fulfilled this obligation by committing attrocities against dhimmis.
Fundamently, Muslims can never conceive that attrocities committed
against non-Muslims (in this case Israeli Jews) are wrong.  Therefore,
Muslims will never cease these acts unless the government of the State
of Israel makes it quite clear that the 'umma will suffer far more
severely.  Once the 'umma realizes collectively that it will suffer,
the 'umma will prevent individuals from carrying out the usual Islamic
attrocities. 

The logic is the same as attacking German cities when German armies
invade the Soviet Union.  Obviously, the citizens in the cities were
not part of the invasion force (although they might eventually serve
in the army), but they are part of the nation which the army
represents.  Punishing the citizenry is a way of making the German
nation pay for the acts of the German army when it commits aggression
on behalf of the nation.

In general, many of Israel's problems arise from not punishing the
Islamic 'umma enough for terrorist Islamic attrocities which
individual Muslims commit as expressions of the will of the Muslim
'umma.

The Muslim resistance in the land of Israel is not analogous to French
freedom fighters but rather to the KKK at the end of reconstruction.

The Muslims are former oppressors for Israeli Jews who explicitly
state in Arabic at least that they intend to become current
oppressors.  The French underground specifically attacked German
military targets and rarely bothered civilians.  Muslim terrorists
almost invariably attack civilian targets and usually kill infants (as
at Ma`alot), old cripples (as at the Achille Lauro) or unarmed
worshippers (as at the Synogogue in Istambul).  

It is symptomatic of Raif Hijab's warped Islamic mentality that he
would want to equate such disgusting Islamic behavior with the French
resistance.  It is interesting that no `alim (as far as I know)
condemned the attack in Istambul and in fact there was at least one
fetwa from al-Ajar that such murder was permissible and probably
mustahab because neither Jews nor any other non-Muslims today are able
to claim dhimma.

If Hijab knows of any `alim who even criticized the attack if only on
the grounds that it makes Islam look bad, I invite him to enlighten
me.

Joachim Carlo Santos Martillo