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From: martillo@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU (Yakim Martillo)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: South Africa Terrorizes Southern Africa
Message-ID: <1244@mit-trillian.MIT.EDU>
Date: Wed, 8-Oct-86 18:50:07 EDT
Article-I.D.: mit-tril.1244
Posted: Wed Oct  8 18:50:07 1986
Date-Received: Thu, 16-Oct-86 05:08:51 EDT
References: <8556@duke.duke.UUCP> <117200040@inmet> <8673@duke.duke.UUCP> <1069@ucbcad.BERKELEY.EDU>
Reply-To: martillo@trillian.UUCP (Yakim Martillo)
Organization: MIT Project Athena
Lines: 45
Keywords: Israel and South Africa

>I am a strong supporter of the right of the ANC to fight against their
>white oppressors. However, I am disturbed by the lack of sensitivity in
>the U.S. for the opression of the Palestinians by the Israelis. Their
>suffering is somehow less important, less weighty on the conscience.

I suspect that as a Muslim, you merely support the right of the
majority to beat on and oppress a minority which is inherent in the
Islamic doctrine of dhimma.  I would be interested in your opinion of
the various attempts of Sudanese Muslims to implose Islamic law on the
non-Muslim black population of the Sudan.

In any case, the discomfort that former oppressors (specifically
Muslim residents of the land or Israel) feel when they see the people
they formerly oppressed free and independent should not be weighty on
anybody's conscience at all.

>Yes, there has been a lot of Palestinian terrorism, much of it senseless,
>useless acts of desperation. But the Palestinians did not start it, nor 
>are they the only terrorists around. In particular, the Israelis are
>guilty of terrorism, BY THE SAME DEFINITION GIVEN ABOVE  -namely,
>fomenting TERROR by attacking civilians. The difference is that they
>hit refugee camps and call them terrorist bases, and destroy villagers'
>homes "to teach them a lesson." YES, a government with a standing army
>can be as much a terrorist as an extralegal gang of desperate young men 
>(or women). 

Hijab is of course correct.  Palestinian Muslims did not start the
terrorism.  Muslim attrocities against defenseless non-Muslims long
pre-date Zionism and in fact occur in Muslim regions far removed from
the land of Israel (e.g. Malaysia).  Since Muslim terrorism against
non-Muslims has an historical continuity of over a millennium and a
global continuity totally independent of the ethnic identity of the
victim, the logical conclusion is that Muslim terrorism has in fact
little to do with Israel but rather is just the natural expression of
Muslim contempt for non-Muslims as repeated expressed in the Qur'an,
the ahadit, the commentaries and the law codes.

>The Palestinians have their terrorists, as does the ANC. But so do the
>Israelis and the Afikaaners. Does the terrorism negate the truth about
>right and wrong? about just and unjust? Why is it that the same person
>who will defend the right of blacks in South Africa to fight racism,
>is squeamish about defending the same right for the Palestinians? 

The basic truth is Islam is wrong and unjust.  When Muslims fix Islam
perhaps peace might be negotiable.