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From: sxnahm@ubvax.UUCP
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc,net.religion.christian
Subject: Re: Tim Maroney's world stoppin' questions!!
Message-ID: <552@ubvax.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 25-Sep-86 13:52:17 EDT
Article-I.D.: ubvax.552
Posted: Thu Sep 25 13:52:17 1986
Date-Received: Mon, 29-Sep-86 01:13:26 EDT
References: <5005@decwrl.DEC.COM> <2966@pyuxd.UUCP> <2573@watdcsu.UUCP>
Reply-To: sxnahm@ubvax.UUCP (Stephen Nahm)
Followup-To: talk.religion.misc
Distribution: net
Organization: Ungermann-Bass, Inc., Santa Clara, Ca.
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Xref: linus talk.religion.misc:271 net.religion.christian:4745
Summary: Be precise in order to be understood.

In article <2573@watdcsu.UUCP> magore@watdcsu.UUCP (M.A.Gore - ICR) writes:
>	I contend that many Christians believe God from experience. That is
>the Bible tells of a testable method to find Him (no blind faith just be
>determined). Such experience is what I contend is the reason for yet more
>'faith'.  Just as we understand that the sun will rise (because we know why).

You are misusing the word "faith".  Faith means "belief in something for
which there is no proof".  That the Sun will rise can be proven (to the
satisfaction of most people).  "Faith" can also mean "complete confidence",
but the "despite lack of proof" is generally implied.

Your contention that people believe in God because of personal experience
brings up an interesting point.  Any "proof" of any issue must be evaluated
by each person; they base their judgement of the correctness of the proof on
their own experience (which constitutes their reality).  I can believe that a
person honestly believes in God because in their reality God speaks to them,
causes things to mysteriously happen, thwarts Evil and promotes Good.
However a non-believer might take these reported manifestations of God as
the products of an active imagination, since these are not consistent with
the non-believer's experience of reality.

If you wish to be understood, please be clear: "I believe in God because of
the proof of my experience which is [so and so]."  The rest of us can then
judge your assertions with respect to *our* view of reality.

>                                                But making up stories about
>how Christians think etc... also does not help the cause of discussion...

Be precise, and no one will have to make up any stories.

  When *I* use a word," Humpty Dumpty said in a rather scornful tone, "it
  means just what I chose it to mean -- neither more nor less."

  "The question is," said Alice, "whether you *can* make words mean so many
  different things."
-- 
Steve Nahm                  UUCP route:       {amd|cae780}!ubvax!sxnahm
sxnahm@ubvax.UUCP           Internet address: amd!ubvax!sxnahm@decwrl.DEC.COM