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From: WLIM@XX.LCS.MIT.EDU
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Subject: (none)
Message-ID: <12253969070.33.MCGREW@RED.RUTGERS.EDU>
Date: Mon, 10-Nov-86 23:22:31 EST
Article-I.D.: RED.12253969070.33.MCGREW
Posted: Mon Nov 10 23:22:31 1986
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  From: mcgeer%sirius.Berkeley.EDU@BERKELEY.EDU (Rick McGeer)

  ...give me a break....

What are you trying to say here?


  I haven't seen all that much in private office buildings.  There,
  the walls are cleaned with some regularity.

So, the problem does exist in private office buildings, it is just
that they do a better job cleaning the walls.  You seem to have a
point here i.e. the state does not seem to take care of its property
very well.  Is it the case then that the state (again, anywhere on
this earth) can *NEVER* do a good job in taking care of its property?

  That doesn't seem to apply to city busses, which are regularly
  vandalized.

Is it your point that the problem is universal i.e. it is a problem
with most if not all city busses *ANYWHERE* on this earth?  To support
this you have to provide evidence indicating that the problem exists
not only in New York or some US cities which happen to have high crime
rates but also in cities with low crime rates *ANYWHERE* on this
earth.

  I said that crime and graffiti are only a problem in
  publically-controlled places.  They are *NOT* problems on
  privately-controlled conveyances and parks, because there, someone
  gives enough of a damn to stop crime and vandalism before it starts.

Again you only give New York and US cities as examples what about
Tokyo, Moscow, Beijing, Sydney, Toronto, etc.?  You also seem to be
saying that the problem will not exist if someone give a damn
irrespective of whether the property is publicly or privately owned.
Maybe the problem is just that we (Americans, can't say anything about
the others since you didn't give any evidence about this being their
problem) don't give a damn when it comes to publicly owned properties.

   Well, statists are pretty dim-witted to start with, so I wouldn't
   be surprised to see one cheering his own execution.

I'll leave it to the statists to answer this insult to their
intelligence.

  But if you really need more evidence than I have provided, go across
  Technology Square at oh, say, midnight or so, climb on the T, and
  ride around for awhile.  To the Common, say.  Or hop on the IRT and
  ride north through Manhattan's West Side.  Loiter around the
  stations just above 115th, say.  If you come back alive, you'll have
  the evidence you need.

Since you insist on degenerating into this form of debating then
consider this...  Statists might see your attending a state school as
something to cheer about given that (1) you are not a statist, (2) you
are not a sucker (i.e. you wouldn't go to a state school if the state
is screwing things up so badly), (3) there are lots of good private
graduate schools out there (MIT, Harvard, Stanford, Yale, CMU,....)
for you to choose from, and (4) that Berkeley does indeed provide a
good education.  That should be good enough evidence to you (but not
to me) that the state does not screw things up.  (-: Talking about
cheering your own execution. :-)



Willie
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