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From: rob@arcsun.UUCP (Rob Aitken)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: education
Message-ID: <181@arcsun.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 3-Mar-87 12:00:50 EST
Article-I.D.: arcsun.181
Posted: Tue Mar  3 12:00:50 1987
Date-Received: Wed, 4-Mar-87 02:35:52 EST
References: <213@fornax.uucp> <179@arcsun.UUCP> <217@fornax.uucp>
Distribution: can
Organization: Alberta Research Council, Calgary, Ab.
Lines: 61
Summary: We're getting close to the problem, but can we fix it?

In article <217@fornax.uucp>, chapman@fornax.uucp (John Chapman) writes:
> > <many deleted things>
> Well let me get my rose coloured glasses on. There! As I remember it we
> we pretty adventurous as kids - I certainly got enough lectures on the
> topic (didn't take though :-) ).  Most of the young children I talk to
> seem that way too - the most often used word seems to be "why".

I agree. Once they are in school, however, their "why's" are typically
answered with "how" or "what". Perhaps it is society's emphasis on mundane
rote learning that diminishes the children's enthusiasm. For instance, I
find the reasons behind various conflicts far more interesting than the
precise dates they occurred. This kind of subjective learning is much
harder to measure, however. (Testing is another story...)
 
> >.. Within these settings kids rapidly become very set in their ways,
> Maybe we should keep them out of over-organized settings then?
Maybe, but the sheer numbers of students tend to require some kind of
organization.

> >... (Source for these pronouncements: Denise Aitken, teacher).
> Well I won't quarrel with her experience but I would like to point out
> that she is relating her experiences in our current system - which
> I am (at least partially) convinced produces this effect (lack of
> enthusiasm, need to stick to established routines, etc.).
> Is this inherent in children?  If not how can we stop doing this to them,
> and if so how can we steer them away from it?

I have not seen any objective evidence one way or the other on the last
questions. Routines make it easier to deal with life, but also make life
more boring. This applies equally well to teacher and to student. Coming
up with new ideas every day takes an incredible amount of work.

> I would also like to emphasize that part of what bothers me is the attitude
> children develop towards learning - they not only don't want to do it
> themselves but they are suspicious ([to] be charitable) of those who do
> enjoy it.
I believe Vincent Manis' recent posting on media education and parental
acceptance of poor academic performance explains much of this.

> 2. [our] school system is the wrong answer to the problem, or
> ...Personally I believe 2 is the most correct....
This may be true, but most efforts to change the system are met with the
"Get back to basics! My kid is in grade 2 and doesn't know the capital of
Lower Slobbovia yet!" breed of comment. Many people want school to be
difficult. It was hard for them, so it should be hard for their children.
 
> It seems worth asking what it is the produces the battle-axe burnouts in the
> first place though.
Too much work, too little credit. 
 
> What would Denise change if she could do whatever she wanted with the
> school system?
Her major problems are lack of resources, and poor procedures for dealing
with discipline problems. A full response will follow later.

Rob Aitken
EAN:  aitken@noah.arc.cdn
UUCP: { ...ubc-vision, ...alberta}!calgary!arcsun!rob

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