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From: bandy@amdcad.AMD.COM (Andy Beals)
Newsgroups: news.misc,soc.women
Subject: Re: retraction
Message-ID: <16983@amdcad.AMD.COM>
Date: Wed, 3-Jun-87 21:52:09 EDT
Article-I.D.: amdcad.16983
Posted: Wed Jun  3 21:52:09 1987
Date-Received: Sun, 7-Jun-87 05:13:24 EDT
References: <3767@jade.BERKELEY.EDU> <16895@amdcad.AMD.COM> <3788@jade.BERKELEY.EDU> <16959@amdcad.AMD.COM> <3842@jade.BERKELEY.EDU>
Reply-To: bandy@amdcad.UUCP (Andy Beals)
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc., Sunnyvale, Ca.
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Xref: mnetor news.misc:524 soc.women:4329

[Mark Smith, era1987@violet.berkeley.edu]
>I haven't told any lies.  

Yes you have.  You said that there were swastikas on the Well.  There
are none.  When asked to back it up, you said that the Whole Earth
Review published them as a freedom-of-speech issue.  Since you knew all
along that the swastikas were in the Whole Earth Review magazine and not
on the Well, you have lied.

Proof:

[SMITH] 
>But Kevin had published swastikas in the Whole Earth Review, and in an
>editorial, said that they did it to celebrate free speech--to show that
>they will even publish things that they might personally find offensive.  

[SMITH]
>I'm interested to know why they [the Well] would censor feminist or
>egalitarian views, but not censor porn, obscenity or swastikas.

--------

[BEALS]
>Mark Smith was tossed off of the Well because of Mark's abuse of host
>account privs and for causing large amounts of disruption.  

[SMITH]
>Whoa!  Nobody was tossed off for disruption.  

No, Nobody will help the poor.  Nobody will stop the war.  Nobody cares
about anyone anymore.

You, Mark Smith, were tossed off for disruption, and let's not forget
threats of legal action on the usenet.

[SMITH]
>There was only one other feminist on the Well that I know of when I was
>tossed off.  There had been three others, all paying users, not all female,
>but all feminists, who left the Well due to the attacks on me.  

Names, please.

I do know of at least two other users who left the Well because Mark
Smith was spreading hate directed towards them all over the conferences.
At least one of them came back when told that Mark Smith no longer had a
Well account.

--------

[SMITH]
>The Whole Earth Review had published articles opposing abortion and
>advocating sadomasochism,

The Well (Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link) is not the Whole Earth Review.
Cliff Figallo is not Kevin Kelly, either.  Please do not accuse the Well
of things that the Whole Earth Review does.

If you wish to complain to Kevin, you probably know his e-mail address.  If
you have forgotten, I will mail it to you upon request.

[SMITH]
>Yes, the Well and the Whole Earth Review are both edited by Kevin Kelly.

The Well is not edited by Kevin Kelly.  Kevin moderates some conferences
but there is no editing of items, aside from outright censoring, which
all are aware of when it happens.  Censoring is not something that is
done lightly, as you know, because people always wonder who censored
whom.  I have yet to see a host, aside from yourself, censor a user --
each instance of censoring I've seen has been self-censoring.

Cliff Figallo is the director of the Well.

The Whole Earth Review is not the Well.  If you want to take Kevin to
task for what the Whole Earth Review does, then write a letter to the
editor and complain about it.  

Flaming to the usenet about the Well makes little sense when it is the
Whole Earth Review that is doing things that you do not approve of.
Also, flaming to the usenet is not likely to cause changes at the Well.

-- 
Andrew Scott Beals, {lll-crg,decwrl,allegra}!amdcad!bandy +1 408 749 3683