Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!dalcs!dalcsug!peter From: peter@dalcsug.UUCP (Peter Philip) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga Subject: Re: Yet more A1000->A2000 upgrade questions Message-ID: <152@dalcsug.UUCP> Date: Mon, 5-Oct-87 15:29:42 EDT Article-I.D.: dalcsug.152 Posted: Mon Oct 5 15:29:42 1987 Date-Received: Thu, 8-Oct-87 03:09:46 EDT References: <2398@cbmvax.UUCP> <1102@omepd> Reply-To: peter@dalcsug.UUCP (Peter Philip) Distribution: world Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada Lines: 130 In article <1102@omepd> hah@mipon3.UUCP (Hans Hansen) writes: >In article <2398@cbmvax.UUCP> higgin@cbmvax.UUCP (Paul Higginbottom SALES) writes: >>Q (cont): Now that CBM is on its feet again.. they want to dump the >>A1000 and support the two newer one's A500 and A2000. >> >>[The MARKETPLACE is determining this. > >Commodore Marketing NOT the market place is KILLING the A1000 ! Just so YOU >get it straight ! ... > Gee, from initial reactions of local dealers, the A2000 & A500 are selling great (Canada has had both of these for about 2 months) after a huge decline in A1000 sales. I wonder what this could mean? Could it be that the MARKETPLACE is casting its vote for the A2000/A500 rather than the A1000??? NAW, must be TOTALY the fault of CBM marketing, right?? >> If all three Amigas were on >>the market, there would be too much overlap, and the customer would >>probably be confused. > >Don't you mean that Commodore Marketing would be confused ?! Commodore >Marketing has NEVER identified the/a market for the Amiga. Instead of >aggressively attacking the business $$$ world, with the best business >computer for the buck in the world, you have floundered with MORONIC, >STUPID, and INEPT commercials and ads ! If you had used 10% of the >wasted ad monies to bring to market IBM compatable business software, >READ 680x0 NATIVE CODE THAT CAN READ AND WRITE ibm FORMATTED DISKS >(BOTH 3.5 AND 5.25 INCH) AND AMIGA FORMATTED DISKS, at the Amiga's debut >in New York there would be over 1 million Amiga 1000s in the world today! Hans, have you ever read anything about market segmentation - it's pretty basic stuff - NO? You really should, it might prevent some of this drivel. Instead of making unfounded insults, why don't you back up your statements - how do you know that there would be more than 1,000,000 Amigas in the world today? Done the market research, have you? >I D O N ' T W A N T A N i b m C O M P U T E R, [ .... ] >I W I L L N E V E R B E A B L E T O R E P L A C E >T H A T O T H E R C O M P U T E R O N M Y D E S K A T W O R K >W I T H A N A M I G A U N T I L T H E S E P R O G R A M S R U N >N A T I V E O N T H E A M I G A ! > I S Y O U R C A P S L O C K K E Y S T U C K H A N S ? ? ? ? Oh, so what you are saying is that you don't want an IBM computer, just a computer that will run all the IBM software. Did you ever consider that software porting/development is really not up to Commodore-Amiga? "Hey, Lotus and Microsoft - you guys better port over your programs or us guys at Amiga are gonna shut you down!!" ;-) >The Amiga is not a toy, what it is is a business computer that can emulate >a toy! It is a business computer that can be used for anything a creative >programmer can envision. It IS a BUSINESS COMPUTER that hackers love to >hack on! IT IS A BUSINESS COMPUTER without any business software !!!!! > That should suggest something to you, Hans. (maybe it is not a business computer after all) you seem to think that a computer has to be a business computer to suceed. Guess what? It dosen't. >>A500 and A2000 products are possible because of 2 years of research >>and development after the A1000 was launched, and therefore, if the >>A1000 were to remain on the market, it would have to be changed >>anyway. > [Paul bings up some good points about rebate policy and new products ] >>new products? >> > >What NEW product? You have repackaged the A1000 and stripped out a >very valuable piece of hardware. Oh I guess you are refering to the >clock circuit (A500) or maybe you are refering to the 1000w power >supply in the A2000, for surely can't be refering to the A2000 IBM >clone sockets!?? I can buy 3 PC clones for the price of one A2000 ! > How about the Amiga slots? Yea, I guess you're right, it is better to have a huge box hanging off the side of the A1000 then the neater/ cheaper/more functional card arrangement that the A2000 offers. :-) Or how about those IBM slots, as much as you would hate to admit this, MS DOS is the *STANDARD* for business applications, Commodore would be fools to compete for that same market with a non-compatible machine, with the A2000, they can offer a compatible - yet unique - solution to the "I don't like IBM" dilemma by offering the user the best of both worlds. The question is not that you can buy 3 Clones for the price of an A2000, but that you can combine two _different_ systems into one that work _together_, the result being more than the sum of its parts! >Where is the PRICE/PERFORMANCE improvement? Neither the A500 or the >A2000 offers any performance improvements. What you have done is take >functionality out of both the A500 and the A2000, no WCS, no NTSC color >signals. The only real improvement is the keyboard, I tried to get >Amiga engineering to use the DEC VT100 keyboard layout in 1984! > Boy, you sure were clever back then! If you loved the idea of the WCS so much, why didn't YOU do anything with it? When I bought my Amiga the big clamour about the WCS was that it could be used to replace the OS with UNIX or some other OS ... two years later -- not one commercial product (besides WB/KS 1.2) has been released that replaces kickstart. My point? now that C-A have blessed 1.2 with being the "official" release of the OS, why: 1) waste time booting KS. 2) raise the price of the machines [lots of other unjustified claims deleted ... ] I would just like to say that I love my A1000 just as much as the next guy (hell, I was the first one in Nova Scotia to have one!) but I can see that it has some weaknesses (in my opinion), such as inconvenient and expensive expansion, no room for extra internal devices, incompatible cables, and the WCS (I hate kickstart!!!). Those of us who have A1000's have NIL to complain about, if you like your A1000 - KEEP IT! If you don't, take advantage of Commodore's VERY GENEROUS offer and get a new computer for $1000! So, while the A2000 is not a giant leap for mankind, it is reasuringly in the right direction. > >Hans Hansen >ATE Test Development Coordinator >GP7SM -- one more super whizzy from the company that started it all. > >These be my words and no one elses. I speak for me, Intel hires firms >to speak for it, I ain't a firm. Peter Philip Dalhousie University (just a student, so don't blame them for anything I say)