Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!husc6!uwvax!uwmacc!uwmcsd1!leah!itsgw!nysernic!rutgers!bellcore!faline!karn From: karn@faline.bellcore.com (Phil R. Karn) Newsgroups: sci.crypt Subject: Re: Design for a DES-breaker Message-ID: <1477@faline.bellcore.com> Date: Wed, 14-Oct-87 21:15:49 EDT Article-I.D.: faline.1477 Posted: Wed Oct 14 21:15:49 1987 Date-Received: Sat, 17-Oct-87 05:16:15 EDT References: <7449@reed.UUCP-> <1409@osiris.UUCP> <289@apr.UUCP> <17195@glacier.STANFORD.EDU> Organization: Bell Communications Research, Inc Lines: 35 Keywords: NSA, DES Summary: just a minute... > So that's our chip. Each chip can try 20Mhz x 16 keys per second, > or 320 x 10^6 keys per second. I do not know how much chip real estate a DES engine takes, but John's figures seem a tad optimistic when compared to existing technology. Typical commercial DES chips, e.g., the AMD 9518/Z8068, do NOT pipeline their calculations. The 9518 has one set of S and P boxes and iterates 16 times. Including overhead, it takes a total of 18 clock cycles to do one complete encryption or decryption. Key loading isn't particularly fast either. The designers probably considered a low pin count to be more important than making the chip especially useful for key cracking. Pipelining the DES engine would clearly increase its area at least 16 times, since not only do you need 16 copies of the S and P boxes but also 16 key registers. You also need a way to extract the proper subkey in parallel at each of the 16 stages. John further hypothesizes that each chip would contain sixteen of these complete DES engines, for a total complexity increase of at least 256x over existing DES chips. I don't know if the RAM comparison is valid, at least inside the chip, since a DES engine is much less regular than a RAM. True, the 9518 is a few years old, implemented in N-MOS technology, and not specifically designed for key cracking. Still, I don't know if a complexity increase of 256x combined with a speed increase of 5x is reasonable in 1987 CMOS. Perhaps somebody can comment on this. Not that any of this really takes away from the John's valid argument that the DES key is too small. An extra factor of x16 or even x256 really isn't all that much protection given inexorable improvements in technology. Cracking DES through brute force is still out of range of a plug-in card for your PC, but certainly not out of the capability of the NSA with custom VLSI and much more computer room floor space than John allowed for his machine. Phil