Path: utzoo!hoptoad!cpsc6a!rtech!mtxinu!unisoft!gethen!farren
From: farren@gethen.UUCP (Michael J. Farren)
Newsgroups: alt.flame
Subject: Re: Theological Debates
Message-ID: <550@gethen.UUCP>
Date: 9 Jan 88 07:27:15 GMT
References: <4062@uwmcsd1.UUCP> <514@gethen.UUCP> <4080@uwmcsd1.UUCP> <22421@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU> <4107@uwmcsd1.UUCP>
Reply-To: farren@gethen.UUCP (Michael J. Farren)
Organization: There's Unix there in Oakland
Lines: 51
Keywords: Comma

markh@csd4.milw.wisc.edu (Mark William Hopkins) writes:
>robinson@dewey.soe.berkeley.edu (Michael Robinson) writes:
>>> markh@csd4.milw.wisc.edu (Mark William Hopkins) writes:
>>>>>     Maybe, I ought to clarify myself, as there seem to be those who
>>>            ^
>>>       This is correct usage, given my intentions.  A comma denotes a
>>>pause, it was a pause that was intended here. 
>>
>>Wrong, again, Mister Remedial.  Is that what they're teaching you at
>      ^
>>A pause, when it is a semantic entity unto itself, is represented by an
>>ellipsis.
>...or by a comma, period, colon or semi-colon.  

Wrong.  Commas separate clauses, mostly.  Periods end sentences.  Colons
and semicolons are used to separate clauses differently than commas.  The
point is that, although the spoken word represents all of those as pauses
of varying duration, their purpose, when used in the written word, is not
as simplistic as simply indicating a pause.  You are wrong.   Your comma,
AND that of Michael Robinson's which you have pointed out, are wrong.
Your position is untenable and, frankly, pretty stupid.

>In any case, what makes the nit-pickers' position so untenable is that they 
>cannot even observe the very "rules" they set out to impose on others.  It's
>this hypocracy that gives the proscriptivists the bad "bookish" reputation
>they have.

Have you ever heard of a mistake?  Or, failing that, of satiric effect?
All things considered, I'm surprised that you didn't start screaming and
yelling when you saw my original response to your comma gaffe, which 
included nearly every punctuation mark available on this keyboard.

>     In any case, notice that where the two marks occur, a comma DOES denote
>a pause: the kind that we would make after uttering an expletive and before
>uttering the remaining sentence.i

But neither 'Maybe' nor 'Wrong' are expletives.  Expletives, when used, are
followed with exclamation points, not commas.  If you had written "Maybe!
I ought to clarify myself ..." or "Maybe.  I ought to clarify myself ...",
then you would have been right.  As it is, you are not.

Oh, while we're at it...  "I ought to clarify myself" is also wrong.  You
cannot clarify yourself, unless you are the Invisible Man.  What you ought
to have clarified is your position or your statement.  Neither seems
particularly clear so far.

-- 
Michael J. Farren             | "INVESTIGATE your point of view, don't just 
{ucbvax, uunet, hoptoad}!     | dogmatize it!  Reflect on it and re-evaluate
        unisoft!gethen!farren | it.  You may want to change your mind someday."
gethen!farren@lll-winken.llnl.gov ----- Tom Reingold, from alt.flame