Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!husc6!bbn!rochester!rutgers!sdcsvax!ucbvax!FSU.BITNET!VAXPOST From: VAXPOST@FSU.BITNET (Testing Vax Bitnet Connection) Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st Subject: Unexpected status code returned by VMS MAIL \%X007E10A2\ Message-ID: <8801071935.AA21451@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> Date: 7 Jan 88 19:37:12 GMT Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Organization: The ARPA Internet Lines: 470 X-Unparsable-Date: 7-JAN-1988 13:41:06.64 --------------- A copy of your rejected mail message follows --------------- Received: by CANADA01 (Mailer X1.24) id 1753; Thu, 07 Jan 88 13:26:20 EDT Date: Thu, 7 Jan 88 09:48:35 PST Reply-To: Info-Atari16@Score.Stanford.edu Sender: INFO-A16@CANADA01 From: Info-Atari16@Score.Stanford.EDU Subject: Info-Atari16 Digest V88 #8 To: PETCHER@GW.SCRI.FSU.EDU, DUBRAVK@FSU Info-Atari16 Digest Thursday, January 7, 1988 Volume 88 : Issue 8 This weeks Editor: Bill Westfield Today's Topics: Re: ST Drive Change? DG Terminal Emulators... Re: BMS controller package Re: ST software available for children? VCR -> Atari ST color monitor Re: Observations IBM Drives with ST Re: A defense of Multi-tasking Re: about ST disk drives (and media change) Re: Multi-tasking? A nightmare... Re: Hard disk boot??? Re: Hard disk boot??? Re: big arrays in MW C Re: Multi-tasking? A nightmare... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 28 Dec 87 04:44:06 GMT From: portal!cup.portal.com!Sam_Brian_Gridley@uunet.uu.net Subject: Re: ST Drive Change? To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu Have done it many times myself without encountering any problems. Even swapped the SS out of my 520STfm for a DS disk mechanism. Works great! ------------------------------ Posted-From: The MITRE Corp., Bedford, MA To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu, info-atari8@score.stanford.edu Subject: DG Terminal Emulators... Date: Mon, 28 Dec 87 17:56:52 EST From: jhs@mitre-bedford.ARPA KOST@TRIUMFCL.BITNET writes... > > Does anyone know of a Terminal Emulator for the Data General > machines, eg. the D-400 series terminal, for the Atari ST. > I'd be interested also in such an emulator that ran on the Atari 8-bitters, if anyone knows about one! -John Sangster / jhs@mitre-bedford.arpa ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 21:02:00 GMT From: apollo!weber_w@eddie.mit.edu (Walt Weber) Subject: Re: BMS controller package To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu In article <1147@eneevax.UUCP> iarocci@eneevax.umd.edu.UUCP (John Iarocci) writes: > >Being the owner of two BMS kits (one for a Micropolis 1325 on a 1040, and one >for a Seagate ST506 on a 520+), I have seen how Berkley Microsystems has >improved over the last year or so. I think their present-day package is well >put together and easy to build. I have only had two reservations about the >kit: 1) The non-standard format used on the disks, and 2) THAT SHORT CORD!! > >Until a recent (fairly) Atari Fest in the area, I was under the impression >that the BMS kit was the only one out there. At this fair, I was introduced >to ICD, Inc. I, too, am a VERY SATISFIED customer of BMS. My opinions of the ICD offering differ somewhat from yours, however. I saw ICD's product at the Worcester AtariFest, and while I think they have an acceptable product, I believe that their methods are less than acceptable. My local Atari dealer (exclusively Atari for the last 4+ years) tells me that ICD has been present in the 8-bit marketplace for a considerable time. My contact at BMS, however, told me that ICD initially contacted BMS with a great deal of interest in the BMS board, and assured BMS that ICD was not going to get into that business. A short while later, ICD released a board which has a strong resemblance to the BMS board with a few modifications. Note that I am NOT advocating sole-sourcing of add-ons for the ST line -- I just do NOT like the idea of an "established" company staying out of the ST marketplace until (or unless) they can piggyback off of the efforts of a fledgling operation by misrepresenting their intentions. As to your first reservation (above), BMS follows the Atari standard of only allowing 4 partitions per drive, while Supra established an "extended format" which permits 8 partitions per drive, but is NOT compatible with Atari's AHDI. ICD follows the Supra extended format. I think if you go back to Tom Love's excellent article in a back issue of Current Notes you will find that BMS did not have a disk driver of their own, and that users would just use Atari's formatter (format.prg?) and driver (ahdi.prg). ..walt... -- Walt Weber PHONE: (617) 256-6600 x7004 Apollo Computer GENIE: W.WEBER Chelmsford, People's Republic of Massachusetts ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 23:37:18 GMT From: tpg@mitre-bedford.arpa (Terry P. Gleason) Subject: Re: ST software available for children? To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu LOGO isn't bundled with the ST anymore. Is it worth buying? Are there other better ones available? (My daughter uses LOGO on the Apple at school.) Is KIDTALK ($30-$40) a good buy? For what ages is it appropriate? Thanks for any advice - T. Gleason (tpg@mbunix) ------------------------------ Date: 29 Dec 87 00:24:31 GMT From: engst@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu (Adam C. Engst) Subject: VCR -> Atari ST color monitor To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu I'm curious, does anyone know of a ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 21:48:26 GMT From: tektronix!sequent!mntgfx!dclemans@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Dave Clemans) Subject: Re: Observations To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu > I kinda liked the "ST World" that my dealer used to carry, but he > stopped carrying it a couple of months before he folded. :-( > Did the newspaper fold too? Or did the go out of business becuase my > dealer no longer carried them? Or was it the other way around? ;-) ST World is apparently going fine; in fact they've now split into two separate newsletters: ST World mainly reviews and show reports ST Informer more general articles, rumors, etc. They're carried by stores in the Oregon area (B. Dalton's Software Etc. even carries ST World). However note that they are not published on a regular schedule; as far as I can tell they wait until they have enough ads and articles to fill an issue and then go to the printers/distributors. dgc ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 06:31:10 GMT From: unirot!josh@rutgers.edu (josh cohen) Subject: IBM Drives with ST To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu lineaterlineaterlineaterlineater Does anyone have the document file on how to hook up an IBM style drive? I am attempting to do it here. I have a tandon TM100 full height drive. I ripped it out of an old PERCOM setup for the old ataris. Has anyone done this? I see the tricks that atari is doing with the drive select line but am not quite sure how to cope with it. Somebody help me before I fry my ST.... Josh Cohen HOOK ARPA HOOK@aim.rutgers.edu UUCP {...}!rutgers!aim.rutgers.edu!hook BITNET hook%gold.decnet@zodiac please me me at the first address. ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 18:08:51 GMT From: clyde!watmath!water!ljdickey@rutgers.edu (Lee Dickey) Subject: Re: A defense of Multi-tasking To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu In article <5595@cc5.bbn.COM> denbeste@bbn.COM (Steven Den Beste) writes: :The original poster of this subject asked if there was a place where :multi-tasking was "essential". ... : [ a long and thoughtful article here... ] : :Could these be the real reasons behind the original posting? Or maybe just a :deliberate attempt to stir up trouble? : :Steven C. Den Beste, Bolt Beranek & Newman, Cambridge MA :denbeste@bbn.com(ARPA/CSNET/UUCP) harvard!bbn.com!denbeste(UUCP) : I don't think BBN cares what I think about this stuff. : And that's probably just as well. Deliberate or not, he certainly did stirr it up! -- L. J. Dickey, Faculty of Mathematics, University of Waterloo. ljdickey@watmath.UUCP UUCP: ...!uunet!watmath!ljdickey ljdickey%water@waterloo.edu ljdickey@watdcs.BITNET ljdickey%water%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.ARPA ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 17:49:38 GMT From: clyde!watmath!water!ljdickey@rutgers.edu (Lee Dickey) Subject: Re: about ST disk drives (and media change) To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu Thank you, Alan, for the informative answer, which raises another question... In article <914@atari.UUCP> apratt@atari.UUCP (Allan Pratt) writes: > >The media-change sensing is done using the write-protect signal from the >drive. ... > >When a disk is in the "maybe changed" state, the next access (through >RWABS or maybe Floprd) will check the serial number of the disk in the >drive. If it hasn't changed, then the disk hasn't changed, either. >This is another assupmtion: you should not have two disks with the same >serial number. > ... What is the "serial number" you mention? I have seen no mention of it before. I have noticed something called "disk label" that comes up when I ask it to "SHOW INFO". Is *that* the "serial number"? How can I be sure that no two disks have the same serial number? -- L. J. Dickey, Faculty of Mathematics, University of Waterloo. ljdickey@watmath.UUCP UUCP: ...!uunet!watmath!ljdickey ljdickey%water@waterloo.edu ljdickey@watdcs.BITNET ljdickey%water%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.ARPA ------------------------------ Date: 29 Dec 87 07:16:35 GMT From: marque!gryphon!richard@csd1.milw.wisc.edu (Richard Sexton) Subject: Re: Multi-tasking? A nightmare... To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu In article <1374@uhccux.UUCP> lee@uhccux.UUCP (Greg Lee) writes: >In article <2673@gryphon.CTS.COM> richard@gryphon.CTS.COM (Richard Sexton) writes: >>In article <3256@umn-cs.cs.umn.edu> davidli@umn-cs.UUCP (Dave Meile) writes: > >Mr. Sexton's comments don't bear repeating. It was suggested in another >news group that he has a net variety of Tourette's syndrome. Ah yes, but I'm cute and have great legs. > Would Dave >Meile and others in comp.sys.arari.st please accept an apology from >us amiga folks? Don't apologize for me you nimrod. I have nothing against ST's or their owners. But Atari people who blather in comp.sys.amiga about how the amiga's features are "not needed" are fair game. If you want to flame amiga's, fine. Do it in comp.sys.not.amiga. Do it in alt.flame. But do it in this group, and you just may get a rebuttel. Do it four times and people may get testy. sig missing in newport beach harbour Richard [kick butt and take names] Sexton ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 14:54:00 GMT From: cca!mirror!datacube!ftw@husc6.harvard.edu Subject: Re: Hard disk boot??? To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu uace0@uhnix2.UUCP writes: > The problem you have with holding down the alt-ctrl-shift may have to do with > WHEN you hold down the keys. If you bootup with! the keys down, then it will > not work with the new ROMs. > Try turning on the machine (or resetting) wait a second, then hold down the > keys. This should work. > Don't use GEMBOOT with th[e new ROMs, use foldrxxx.prg instead. So, let me see... If there is a disk in the drive at power-on, the Supra boots *immediately*. If I have the three keys down (diskette in drive), Supra still boots immedately. Seems like I have to: turn machine on. Wait about one second. Push the three keys. (Maybe wait for ST to go after the floppy drive again) Push diskette into drive while holding the keys down. What a pain! I don't think it'll work, either. I'm going to call Supra today and ask them if they have a boot program that is a little less zealous ;-) > Also, I had the same[ problem with the message about a non-supported ROM > version. Ignore the message, the driver is actually installed, and works > just fine. > - Mike > -- > #-----------------------------------------------------# University (of Houston) > # It is morally wrong to let a sucker keep his money. # Atari Computer > #-----------------------------------------------------# Enthusiasts (UACE) > Use Atarinet: for help, interactively send a message to UH-INFO@UHUPVM1 Farrell T. Woods Datacube Inc. Systems / Software Group 4 Dearborn Rd. Peabody, Ma 01960 VOICE: 617-535-6644; FAX: (617) 535-5643; TWX: (710) 347-0125 INTERNET: ftw@datacube.COM UUCP: {rutgers, ihnp4, mirror}!datacube!ftw "OS/2 -- Half an operating system" ------------------------------ Date: 28 Dec 87 20:01:00 GMT From: cca!mirror!datacube!ftw@husc6.harvard.edu Subject: Re: Hard disk boot??? To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu This morning, I wrote: > uace0@uhnix2.UUCP writes: >> The problem you have with holding down the alt-ctrl-shift may have to do with >> WHEN you hold down the keys. If you bootup with! the keys down, then it will >> not work with the new ROMs. >> Try turning on the machine (or resetting) wait a second, then hold down the >> keys. This should work. >> Don't use GEMBOOT with th[e new ROMs, use foldrxxx.prg instead. > So, let me see... If there is a disk in the drive at power-on, the Supra > boots *immediately*. If I have the three keys down (diskette in drive), > Supra still boots immedately. Seems like I have to: turn machine on. Wait > about one second. Push the three keys. (Maybe wait for ST to go after the > floppy drive again) Push diskette into drive while holding the keys down. > What a pain! I don't think it'll work, either. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > I'm going to call Supra today and ask them if they have a boot program > that is a little less zealous ;-) I just got off the phone with a tech-support guy at Supra. He tells me that the scenario described above is exactly what I have to do; they cannot program around it. They say that the problem is in the "blitter" ROMs. The keycode that is made by ctrl-shift-alt isn't available to the Supra boot program as soon as that program would really like it to be. The boot program cannot detect the key combo until much later in the boot, at which time the program is just about to boot from the fixed disk anyway. Farrell T. Woods Datacube Inc. Systems / Software Group 4 Dearborn Rd. Peabody, Ma 01960 VOICE: 617-535-6644; FAX: (617) 535-5643; TWX: (710) 347-0125 INTERNET: ftw@datacube.COM UUCP: {rutgers, ihnp4, mirror}!datacube!ftw "OS/2 -- Half an operating system" ------------------------------ Date: 29 Dec 87 05:53:08 GMT From: ihnp4!chinet!dag@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel A. Glasser) Subject: Re: big arrays in MW C To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu In article <291@stag.UUCP> trb@stag.UUCP ( Todd Burkey ) writes: >Hi, > Does anyone know if MWC will safely handle large arrays now? I know >that I had problems in the early versions with HDSCAN's arrays in that >I had to keep the total amount of data in a particular array less than >32K bytes. Now when I compile tests (i.e. a char[10000][12]), I get a >message like: > strict: size of array overflows size_t > This message is just a warning -- it is because size_t is in fact an unsigned int in MWC 2.1.7. size_t is the default type of the result of the sizeof operator. MWC does support objects larger than 64K now, and this warning is harmless unless you are passing sizeof(foo) to a function that is expecting an int. Sizeof is promoted to a long when it overflows the unsigned int. When MWC releases an ANSI conforming (rather than K&R, which is what it conforms to now with some ANSI extensions), size_t will become a long instead of an int, and then this kind of warning will go away. Even in version 2.0, external objects of > 32K were supported, they just could not be declared. They could be allocated with lmalloc() and then accessed as arrays using the pointer/array equivilance. I hope all of this helps. -- Daniel A. Glasser ...!ihnp4!chinet!dag ...!ihnp4!mwc!dag ...!ihnp4!mwc!gorgon!dag One of those things that goes "BUMP!!! (ouch!)" in the night. ------------------------------ Date: 29 Dec 87 07:00:10 GMT From: coplex!jim@BLOOM-BEACON.MIT.EDU (Jim Sewell) Subject: Re: Multi-tasking? A nightmare... To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu In article <2598@killer.UUCP>, elg@killer.UUCP (Eric Green) writes: [conversation ommitted] > 2) Most of us are notoriously short on foresight, like I was when I > thought that 64K and a floppy drive was the epitomy of computing (after all, I > can do everything you can, right? I can process words, play games, etc.?). > -- > Eric Lee Green elg@usl.CSNET Snail Mail P.O. Box 92191 > {cbosgd,ihnp4}!killer!elg Lafayette, LA 70509 > "There's someone in my head, but it's not me...." -PF Speaking of being short on foresight, it was only today that I was modifying my handy dandy disk re-organizer program (Devices are a pain!) and guess what? I was trying to ^XF (save and finish up) out of Emacs and was out of disk space. How many of you have ever told an editor you were finished, fallen short of disk space, and lost everything because the editor was not taught social graces? I'm sure I'm not the only one. Solution? Use my MULTITASKING Amiga to clean out some disk space before I clicked on the retry block of the requestor. Result? I didn't kill my entire family due to the frustration of losing my program. Moral? Even though nearly anything can be simulated with proper programming on a non M-T system, it rarely is. Many programmers take short cuts which do not allow for mistakes. M-T'ing systems are like insurance in case your favorite program has problems. ================================================================================ Jim Sewell "Make knowledge free!" <*> <*> Code: 1-1A / ------------------------------ End of Info-Atari16 Digest ************************** -------