Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!lll-winken!lll-lcc!ames!ll-xn!mit-eddie!uw-beaver!apollo!ganek
From: ganek@apollo.uucp (Dan Ganek)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.news
Subject: Re: NeWS on non-Sun hardware?
Message-ID: <3a15b3ba.c82a@apollo.uucp>
Date: 4 Feb 88 17:00:00 GMT
References: <3a06a194.c32@apollo.uucp> <1652@ssc-vax.UUCP>
Organization: Apollo Computer, Chelmsford, Mass.
Lines: 79


I probably shouldn't do this --  but every once in awhile I get a little 
upset at the Apollo bashing. 

benoni@ssc-vax.UUCP (Charles L Ditzel @ Boeing Aerospace Corp., Seattle WA)
writes:

> *FLAME ON*
> Its hard for me too take all this to seriously...how many years have we
> we heard that a decent version of Unix would be forthcoming 
> to the Apollo any day soon (i'm still waiting).  
> 
> Its nice to see you people at Apollo suddenly discovering standards...
> Your history somehow speaks differently :
> while Sun chose CGI (a standard you see on PC and other machines)
> as their primitives libraries you people chose your creation GPR with
> ungodly function call names.  
> 
> while Sun chose Ethernet you people chose a proprietary domain ring
> (oh yes - Apollo has suddenly discovered Ethernet too - tho' it has
> all sorts of flaws - tune in on comp.sys.apollo sometime)
> 
> while Sun chose Unix you people had already rejected that for your
> own creation - Aegis.  (Ever see what happens to Aegis and Unix live
> together - any attempt at keeping file permissions straight dies.
> You learn to live in an environment where people can't do somethings
> in Unix and pop an Aegis shell and do it in that shell (and vice-versa).
> 
> oh yes..when you finally found Unix...people wondered if your
> implementation was an advertisement for Aegis.  
> Permissions are only the tip of the iceberg...
> *FLAME OFF*

**FLAME OFF** (for now)

I'm am a physicists by training and as such  believe in the principle
of causality, i.e the future can't affect the past.

Some facts (or approximations thereof):
1) Apollo was founded in Feb, 1980
2) Apollo shipped its first workstation and window system in March, 1981.
3) Neither CGI, Sun, nor the PC market existed in 1980.
4) Ethernet was not a (de facto) standard in 1980.
5) UNIX was barely out of the university in 1980 and had 
   little in the way of modern OS facilities. (still doesn't)
   
Apollo chose the BEST TECHNOLOGIES OF THE TIME (1980), improved
many of them (like UNIX). Nobody is perfect. Apollo is the ONLY 
major worksation company left from its era. (What happened to all 
those UNIX based workstation companies of 1980??) Johnny-come-lately's 
(like SUN) will of course take advantage of newer technologies and 
mistakes of predecessors. Apollo did - there's nothing wrong with that.
I certainly don't complain about SUN learning from our mistakes.

**FLAME ON**

   ANYONE CAN BE A MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACK!

**FLAME OFF**

So, please give credit were credit is due and check your chronology!

Standards are a very tricking business.  It's a big gamble
because standards represent the 'status quo' which is basicaly
incompatible with 'state-of-the-art'. A high-tech company has 
to constantly make a descisions about standards:

1) go with a standard and hope that something better DOESN'T 
   become a standard 
2) go with the new and bet that IT will become the standard.

Apollo has done well in this arena - but not perfectly. We created
and dominated the technical workstation market - we misjudged some
things - we learn from our mistakes. We have and will modify our
products and architectures to meet the demands of the future. Right
now SUN APPEARS to be doing some things right  - maybe they are and maybe
they aren't - only time will tell.  Oops -- this is sounding too much 
like an excuse.  I'll stop now.

/dan ganek