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Path: utzoo!hoptoad!ptsfa!amdahl!ames!hao!gatech!ukma!husc6!bloom-beacon!athena.mit.edu!lazarus
From: lazarus@athena.mit.edu (Michael Friedman)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.flame
Subject: Re: Historical and Geographic inaccuracies.
Message-ID: <3096@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU>
Date: 21 Feb 88 03:50:59 GMT
References: <792@athos.rutgers.edu> <9612@steinmetz.steinmetz.UUCP>
Sender: daemon@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: lazarus@athena.mit.edu (Michael Friedman)
Organization: Murder Inc.
Lines: 91

In article <9612@steinmetz.steinmetz.UUCP> sunset!oconnor@steinmetz.UUCP writes:
>An article by steve@crcmar.crc.uucp (Steve Ardron) says:
>] > It's much easier indeed to be like all other European countries who 
>] > carefully avoid to get directly involved in the Middle East. 
>] > Let French and American and Israeli idiots die in Lebanon, while Royal 
>] 				      ^^^^^^
>] Exactly! The only reason Americans died is because they were stupid!
>] (I'm refering ot marines, not civilians, many other countries have lost
>] civilians) Their Goddamned weapons weren't even loaded! and their
>] security measures were ludicrous.

>That does it. There aren't enough insults in the whole world for
>you, you half-brained uninformed oppinionated asshole.

I fully agree. Steve Ardron is either appallingly misinformed or just
plain appalling.  

>The IDIOTS who died in Lebanon were the Civilians. They didn't have
>to be there and should have left. Same for the damn civilian
>hostages : to hell with them, they knew the risks.

Here I disagree. They are Americans and there should not be any place
on Earth that an American cannot go to in reasonable safety.

>I'm pretty
>god damn tired of our servicemen paying the price for these
>self-important assinine civilians who go to these war zones.

Yes, well the reason we have servicemen is to protect asinine
civilians. If an American wants to go to Lebanon he should be able to
do so knowing that if he is kidnapped he will be rescued or his
murders will pay a very high price.

>The Marines were ordered in there, ordered NOT to load their weapons,
>and NOT ordered to build proper defenses. They did what they were
>ordered to due. Obeying lawful orders is the essense of any
>military organization, but it's part of the pride of the Corps.
>Those men died because they were Marines, not idiots.

Definitely.

>The IDIOTS who killed them where mainly CIVILIANS.

I agree here too.

>Assholes
>who wouldn't let the Marines shoot back.

Here you are getting a little off target. The people who wouldn't let
the Marines shoot back weren't afraid to kill a bunch of terrorists.
They were afraid of being hamstrung in the future by the kind of
Liberal idiots who called the Libya raid murder.

>Who told them to
>hold ground without fighting back. 

Again, the blame here goes at least partially to those who would have
been protesting in Congress and in the streets if the Marines had
fought back.

>Who didn't have a foriegn
>policy that could have dealt with the situation more safely.

The only safe way to deal with the problem would have been to ignore
it. That would have made it worse. By not showing resolve we would
have encouraged our enemies. If we do not maintain a presence in the
Persian Gulf it will soon become the Soviet Gulf.

>The principle IDIOT who got those good soldiers killed was Ronald Reagan.

No. The PRINCIPAL idiots who got those men killed were people like
George Bachrach and the idiots on the net who condemn the Libya raid.
Do you seriously believe that Reagan would have objected to the
Marines carrying loaded guns because it might have lead to a bit of
shooting? Bull. The people who would have objected are the same people
who are currently objecting to our presence in the Gulf. The people
who would have objected are America's isolationists.

>So when a meally-mouthed half-baked ungrateful asshole opens
>his fat trap and calls those men IDIOTS, well DAMN IT sh*t like
>that can't be stood for. I politely suggest you RE-THINK
>you half-assed opinion, and then apologize to the memory
>of those men, to their families, and to the US Marine Corps.

Here once more I fully agree with you. Those men died in the line of
duty, doing their jobs. And we neither retaliated against their
murderers or obtained reparations for their families. I think that's
shameful. 

These are the official opinions			Mike Friedman
of my organization. So, TOUGH!!