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Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!mcvax!diku!keld
From: keld@diku.dk (Keld J|rn Simonsen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga,comp.sys.misc,comp.sys.ibm.pc,comp.sys.mac,comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Copyright notices (was: Shareware? Hah!)
Message-ID: <3708@diku.dk>
Date: 8 Mar 88 22:42:01 GMT
References: <4815@ihlpg.ATT.COM> <3343@killer.UUCP> <2608@gryphon.CTS.COM> <333@esquire.UUCP> <22977@brunix.UUCP> <21023@bbn.COM> <147@bdt.UUCP> <3689@diku.dk> <160@bdt.UUCP>
Organization: DIKU, U of Copenhagen, DK
Lines: 62

In article <160@bdt.UUCP> david@bdt.UUCP (David Beckemeyer) writes:

>My point was that "legal" or not, and regardless of any discussions
>to that effect here or elsewhere:  DON'T GET YOUR HOPES UP.  The
>authorites showed no desire to help a small software company in Oakland;
>that includes both US and German authorites (police and Fed. agencies).

>Any attempts to bring justice would have meant a law suit in German courts.
>Several US and German copyright lawyers (supposedly some of the top ones
>in the world) advised against doing anything (a strange practice for a
>lawyer with nothing to lose) becuase it would be very costly, and the
>outcome would at best be a court order to stop production, which the
>company could simply ignore anyway since the police had better things
>to do.

I got some more info on the history of international copyright laws.
Apparantly UNESCO is dealing with this, this is the forum that the
Berner Convention is discussed. Software protection has been discussed
here too, and during the 1970-ies they reached a concensus that 
software should be protected thru copyright, as a litterary work.
The USA then made the new copyright act in 1980, and some bigger
European countries followed up, notably France and Germany (BRD) in 1985
included software explicitly in the coverage for copyright in their
revisions of copyright laws. 

If you had your troubles in Germany before 1985, then it might have
been because German copyright laws did not cover software at
that time. I am no expert on German law, however.

>In other words: you can read and discuss laws and legalities all you want,
>but in the *real world* all this means very little.

I now presume that your experiences is pre-1985, and that German
law did not protect you. That must have been the reason why neither
the police nor your lawyers would help you. 

If your product enjoys copyright protection and this is violated,
then this is what I understand the Danish law to be: The offence
is a criminal case, and the state attorney is taking your case,
you will not have to pay any lawyers expenses. The offender can get
sentenced to penalties or in worse cases ordinary imprisonment up
to 3 months. I think your case would be of the worse kind, as it
was for profit. The offended has to go to the police and make an
action on the offence.

Additionally you can claim damages, but this is a civil case. 
Having the offender sentenced in the criminal case should make
it easier to get the damages thru in a civil case, though.

I have no experiences of my own on such cases, so your comment on the
real world and slow/uninterested police I cannot offer any real
background for. It is of cause always easier in the books and
and easier if you are near to the offence. It is my impression that
the police takes all criminal offences seriously, especially when
there is much money involved; the courts may be slow though.

I do think though that your German "experience" was caused by lack
of software protection at that time in German laws, and the 
situation has improved considerably since then, the conditions for
foreign software producers in Europe are not as bad as you indicate.

Keld Simonsen, U of Copenhagen      keld@diku.dk