Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!steinmetz!ge-dab!codas!abcom!rgsmeb
From: rgsmeb@abcom.ATT.COM (Michel Behna)
Newsgroups: comp.edu
Subject: Re: What is CS? (Was re First languages)
Message-ID: <364@abcom.ATT.COM>
Date: 25 Mar 88 17:18:10 GMT
References: <1522@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu>
Organization: AT&T, Aurora, Colorado
Lines: 38

From article <1522@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu>, by windley@iris.ucdavis.edu (Phil Windley):
> I couldn't care less what language my students need to know to get a job
> with IBM.  They should know how to program, they should be able to deal
> with abstraction, they should be able to design algorithms, but they
> shouldn't necessarily learn JCL, COBOL (ugh!), or even C because that's
> what HP wants.  
> 
> Phil Windley

You may not care but as someone who graduated and had to find a job I think
you are wrong. Academia has the singular privilege of being able to afford
to hire unknowledgeable (read unskilled) people and training them.

C as a language is a good bet, so is COBOL and eventually ADA. As far as
Pascal or other languages, Good LUCK!!! Fortran is still widely used in
engineering apllications and Lisp in AI.

I agree with you about what they should be able to do(design, abstract,..)
but what good is it to you if the person is unable to translate these into
a language that a computer can understand. It's like having a foreign professor
try to teach you a subject but he is unable to do it in English.

But more important, MOST companies want you to be productive as quickly as
possible - this is especially true if you work for some small company - as they
don't have either the time or resources to devote to your training. Or they may
have deadlines that they have to meet. Furthermore, in a work environment you
don't have the luxury of exploring principles and theories as in a classroom
and so you should concentrate on picking those in class in the subject you're
interested in.

The real world wants productive and bright people! If you're bright they're 
willing to devote a lot of effort to training you but if you are unproductive
BYE BYE!!! This is not to say that design, analysis, ... are non productive
but that rarely do you start as a senior systems analyst. There are a few
positions out there which require research but they are rare.

Michel Behna
amdahl!abcom!rgsmeb