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From: orb@whuts.UUCP (SEVENER)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,sci.misc
Subject: Meteorlogy, refraction and Cuba: re to Meritt
Message-ID: <3955@whuts.UUCP>
Date: 21 Mar 88 21:23:28 GMT
References: <3405@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU> <3895@whuts.UUCP> <3588@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU> <3904@whuts.UUCP> <3699@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU> <3925@whuts.UUCP> <119@aplcomm.UUCP>
Reply-To: orb@whuts.UUCP (45263-SEVENER,T.J.)
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Whippany, NJ
Lines: 70

In article <119@aplcomm.UUCP> jwm@stdc.jhuapl.edu.UUCP (James W. Meritt) writes:
>In article <3925@whuts.UUCP> orb@whuts.UUCP (45263-SEVENER,T.J.) writes:
>.    Refraction *only* occurs in a *non*uniform medium or when going from
>.    one uniform medium to another.
>
>I notice that your references contain nothing on meterology.  Perhaps this
>is a cause of your misunderstanding?
>
>While refraction occurs only in a non-uniform medium, a large number
>of people would contend that the atmosphere is not such a media.
>Thousands of meterologist, for instance.  Anybody that observes things
>through an atmosphere, and not straight up.  As evidence to this
>non-uniformity, go outside and look at a hot road.  Do you "see" a
>"puddle of water" (or in memory, have you?)? When you get there, it is
>gone, yes?  (ok, sometimes it really is a puddle, I mean besides those!)
>What you see there is the sky!  We have here light refracted dozens of degrees
>in just a few feet of air!  And the atmosphere changes radically due to
>temperature (note: Cuba is _VERY_ warm, I have seen 106, water temp in 80's.
>This is a good gradient) and humidity (100% on water surface, less on
>up.  Entire area is muggy, though). 
>
>Are you sufficiently closed minded that you cannot admit there are
>things about which you do not know, or sufficiently prideful that
>you cannot "back out"?

Yes, there are atmospheric anomalies.
So what?
How many of you have ever lived near a fairly large body of water?
Such as the Chesapeake Bay, any of the Great Lakes, or an Ocean
coast.

Could you see the other side?
No.

How many of you have been to Key West?
Please tap your keyboards.
How many of you could see anything besides the horizon?

Right.
None.
Except the Reaganistas like Michael Friedman....

I have already proven that under ordinary conditions it
is *impossible* to see Cuba from Key West.
Is there anything to make us believe that Mr. Friedman's
alleged "sight" of Cuba was under anything other than
ordinary conditions?  Absolutely not.
It was a clear, sunny day he said.
Thermal inversions tend to occur, to my knowledge, in places like
Denver near the mountains, Los Angeles, near the mountains,
and so forth.
What are the chances for a thermal inversion near Cuba?

I doubt it is very likely under a clear, sunny high-pressure
system.

I am perfectly willing to admit to things I do not know when
evidence is presented of their relevance.  I see nothing
so far to merit such relevance or consideration.  I have
lived close to large bodies of water for much of my life.
My direct personal experience is that all I, with 20-20
vision (which Mr. Friedman does *not* have) was able to
see was the horizon.  Period.

Who knows, if one wants to count Mirages, bizarre atmospheric
conditions and everything else as "evidence" then perhaps
Mr. Friedman saw a hologram of Cuba projected by those
awful Commies to instill mindnumbing fear in all Americans :-)

tim sevener  whuts!orb