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From: jefu@pawl23.pawl.rpi.edu (Jeffrey Putnam)
Newsgroups: comp.edu
Subject: Re: What is CS? (Was re First languages)
Message-ID: <607@imagine.PAWL.RPI.EDU>
Date: 3 Apr 88 12:12:15 GMT
References: <3684@medusa.cs.purdue.edu> <568@abcom.ATT.COM>
Sender: news@imagine.PAWL.RPI.EDU
Reply-To: jefu@pawl23.pawl.rpi.edu (Jeffrey Putnam)
Organization: RPI Public Access Workstation Lab - Troy, NY
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In article <568@abcom.ATT.COM> rgsmeb@abcom.ATT.COM (Michel Behna) writes:
>From article <3684@medusa.cs.purdue.edu>, by tlh@cs.purdue.EDU (Thomas L. Hausmann):
>> In article <364@abcom.ATT.COM>, rgsmeb@abcom.ATT.COM (Michel Behna) writes:
>> Do you measure the worth of a computer scientist by how well they program?
>> Admittedly, programming is a SKILL largely taken for granted in universities
>> and within the system.  But whether a university should take the time to
>> train the students to be better programmers is unclear (and I am against it.)

>I think that universities should! I've seen too many so-called _computer
>scientists_ that have come out of college and that end up as programmers. The
>worst part of it is that they do not know how to program. They figure that if
>they can create a nifty algorithm it does not matter if nobody else understands
>it or if they are unable to maintain six months from now.

What bothers me is that many of these so-called computer scientists
dont understand the very real problems involved in implementing the
algorithms, things like interaction with paging, disk io problems and
so on.  I remember one large computational type program that was
blythely running through large arrays across pages (rather than
through them) so the application paged the machine to death (yes, the
order could have been changed).  Written by a computer scientist no
doubt (actually i dont know who wrote it, but this was typical of the
kind of mistake that i have seen computer scientists make).

I have also been bothered by the mindset of many "computer scientists"
who seem to think that only computer science is pure and nice and the
people who actually write code are somehow impure and nasty.  This
species often refuses to learn anything about the systems and programs
that they must use and like to use others as walking manuals and coders.
These people are usually afflicted with a firm belief in their innate
superiority and as a result probably dont get as good results as they
might otherwise.

On the other hand, i know several computer scientists who are primarily
interested in theory but who keep both feet firmly planted in the machine -
people who are not afraid of coding and who really understand the problems
and rewards of actually building systems - and these people tend to 
impress me more with what they do than the other type.  

But then, i am coming to believe that a programming course should be
required of _all_ students - including humanities students and all. 
Computers are increasingly common in all disciplines and workplaces and
a good programming course is the best way to understand the problems and
advantages of computer use.

jeff putnam  
{jefu%pawl -or- jeff_putnam%rpitsmts}@itsgw.rpi.edu
"People would rather believe a simple lie than the complex truth."