Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!husc6!mailrus!ames!pasteur!sting.Berkeley.EDU!sarge
From: sarge@sting.Berkeley.EDU (Steven Sargent)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.modula2
Subject: Re: Anyone seen a good Amiga Pascal lately ?  Why not Modula-2?
Message-ID: <2054@pasteur.Berkeley.Edu>
Date: 4 Apr 88 06:49:22 GMT
References: <764@ndsuvax.UUCP>
Sender: news@pasteur.Berkeley.Edu
Reply-To: sarge@scam.berkeley.edu
Followup-To: comp.lang.pascal,comp.lang.modula2
Organization: Experimental Computing Facility, UC Berkeley
Lines: 36
Keywords: why not, indeed?

> There are two major beefs I have with modula-2.
> 1.  Modula does not allow a variable number of parameters in function calls.
> 2.  Bitwise operators are not available (at least not standard.)
>     Begin end's required even when only one statment used.
> Here is an example of why these things bother me.
> 	If (x = True) Then
> 		WriteLn('Error #',e,' in line #',l,' detected.');
[M2 example elided]
> M2 is too verbose.
Be careful here: writeln is NOT an example of a variadic procedure --
it's actually a funny macro, provided by the Pascal compiler.  If you
don't believe me, try to define a variadic procedure in Pascal.  Can't
do it.  For further evidence, consider the syntax
	write('Error #', e:1);
Try putting the ':' into one of your own procedure calls.  Can't do it.
[specifications of BAND, BSHL, &c. bitwise operators elided]
'Twould be nice.  You can do some of these things with logical-ops on
BITSETs, but BSH[LR] would be tough.  Write 'em in assembly language,
I guess, or C; I don't like the subroutine overhead but it usually wins
over trying to do it in "pure" Pascal/M2.
> Borland could fix modula-2 like they fixed pascal.
Are you the same guy who was concerned about bitwise operators not
being standard?
> Modula-2 should never be forced upon students, it's inhumane.
If you're going to teach a language with unsafe semantics and klutzy
syntax, why not just go with C?  Or even Pascal, since M2 is not
clearly better than Pascal for rank beginners.
> -- 
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Steven Sargent
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