Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!van-bc!root
From: lphillips@lpami.van-bc.UUCP (Larry Phillips)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga
Subject: Re: Time is of the essence on IPC.
Message-ID: <1705@van-bc.UUCP>
Date: 11 Apr 88 07:45:22 GMT
Sender: root@van-bc.UUCP
Lines: 81

In <903@nuchat.UUCP>, peter@nuchat.UUCP (Peter da Silva) writes:
> Putting pipes in a console handler? Defining an IPC protocol
> that's hooked up to a programming language? You seem to have a genius for
> mixing your metaphors.

  Well, I suppose pipes in a shell are a little different than the usual
approach, but I don't see any great problem with it. In fact, _something_
should parse the pipe operator so that you don't have to muck about with
redirection kludges, and can just use a nice, short pipe operator like...
oh, let's use "|". As for an IPC protocol hooked to a programming
language, there are two things I would mention.

First, ARexx ports in a program do not necessarily need ARexx in order for
another program to use them. If an editor has an ARexx interface that
allows commands to be passed to it, any program can do a FindPort and send
commands. It seems to me that the IPC protocol being spoken of on the net
will do exactly the same thing.
Second, allowing a programming language, especially a script/macro
interpreter to do the calling (and to accept commands, data, or status back
from a program) is a great way to make the facility even more powerful by
allowing the user, rather than only the programmer, to specify how any two
programs will interact

> I just find your programs frustrating. They're not Zen. They're so un-Amiga.
> Maybe it's just a matter of personal style, but I can't get over the feeling
> that we're not really working on the same machine.

Which programs of Bill's do you find frustrating? I know it isn't ARexx,
since by your own admission, you don't have it. I use a combination of
WShell, ARexx, ConMan, and PIP: to provide an extremely powerful and easy
to use environment. 

UnAmiga? Last time I looked, script files were part of the Amiga, as were
message ports, windows, command lines, and the ability to tailor
applications to the needs of the user. When a programmer writes an
application, he has no way of knowing what wild and wonderful thing a user
might want to do with it. The author may not have even seen a program that
I want to use in conjunction with it, yet if both contain sufficiently
complete ARexx interfaces, I can use them together in ways that _I_ want to
use them.

> You could send commands to REXX from programs that haven't been set up to
> deal with REXX.

The ARexx interface is well documented. All you need to do from any program
is a FindPort, then start sending messages that conform to the interface
spec.  Of course with the type of IPC being discussed here recently, all
you would have to do is a FindPort, then start sending messages that
conform to the interface spec.

> One of the items on my stack of things to do when I have time is a CON:
> type handler that provides ANSI-style escape sequences to do things like:
>
>	Menus.
>	Function keys.
>	Graphics (probably based on DEC Regis graphics).
>	Changing the title bar.
>	Adding a close box (that sends ^C).
>	Scroll bars like the Bridge Card software's windows.
>
> And with a clipboard interface. That's the sort of thing that a CON: device
> needs.

Sounds a lot like the things you can do with WShell and ARexx.

You really should take a good look at it Peter. I'd be very interested in
hearing your comments about it once you've used it.

-larry

Disclaimer - I have met and chatted with Bill Hawes briefly, and own ARexx
and WShell. Beyond that, I have no connection with Bill.

--
Janus? Well, look at it this way. If you squint a little, the J could be
       Amiga checkmark, and the rest of the word describes MsDos.
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|   //   Larry Phillips                                          |
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