Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!husc6!bloom-beacon!mit-eddie!uw-beaver!cornell!rochester!pt.cs.cmu.edu!andrew.cmu.edu!tm2f+ From: tm2f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Terence David Murphy) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac Subject: Re:IBM did it first Message-ID: Date: 1 May 88 00:12:08 GMT Organization: Carnegie Mellon Lines: 80 In fear of contributing to the childish discussion that has been going on with the list of things IBM did before everyone else, I have a few things to say: a) an analogy. Recently Isuzu has been advertising themselves as the first carmakers of Japan. Does this mean that Isuzu is better than all the other Japanese cars? Even though I don't have much experience with Isuzus, I will point out that most car magazines and Consumer Reports have never praised Isuzus too highly as compared to the rest of the Japanese cars. Hopefully you can see how this analogy applies to these lists of things that IBM did before other manufacturers. b) a few facts about capitalism. In this capatilistic society that we live in (or most of us, since there are international posters on this board), history never means anything. What matters is what exists NOW. (the future doesn't seem to mean much either, because it tends to be a bunch of promises (vaporware) and you have no guarantee of what it will really be like.) So with various people in support of IBM continuing to post these lists, these people are emphasizing the past of IBM (something that doesn't really matter) when they should be talking about IBM today (I'm making it sound like there's been hundreds of these when I've only seen three but things like this tend to stand out in my mind because of their similarity to posts on local Apple II and other bulletin boards that always turn into very unproductive arguments). This is leading me to conclude that you have nothing to say about the benefits of IBMs today except for "sticking with Big Blue." Hardly sounds like a reason to buy a computer to me. And when you're writing your responses to this bulletin, I urge you to think them through calmly because I love a well thought out argument and hate childish rampages that these previous bulletins I'm talking about are most likely going to start. c) a little something to calm you down again. I see Apple doing something very similar to this argument of "we did it first" with their lawsuits against Microsoft and HP. I have yet to meet (or hear from) a "computer consumer" that agrees with these lawsuits. I wish Apple would just sit down and realize that there is always going to be competition out there and the way to win isn't by sueing them but by doing it better than them. So, if you're listening Apple, consider this a challenge to make "easy to use" computers better than everyone else. That's all it takes to compete against these other companies, not lawsuits. If you agree with me, I urge you to sit down and write a letter to Apple and send it to as many places in Apple as you can find (maybe somebody might actually read it). Also, POST THE LETTER HERE! I figure if we can't get them to realize how silly they've been getting lately directly, then maybe we can do it indirectly with active arguments here that someone at Apple will be forced to notice eventually. Along the lines of this idea, I would like to just mention a number of things that I feel are damaging to Apple's future: 1) These lawsuits. see above 2) a low end computer is needed for competition with IBM clones. The other thing consumers look at besides the computer that exists today is the bottom line: price. 3) how about printer drivers and cables for other serial printers? Why force us into buying Apple products, I personally think they're good enough to have a market by themselves (the Imagewriter // is one of the best 9-pin printers I've ever used) and shouldn't have a prefabricated market from all the Macintosh owners. 4) the current policy with charging for replacement fans for the SE. Hopefully, if I can get onto this board when I go home, you'll be seeing a proposal to Apple up here trying to explain how a policy like this can damage their future. 5) dealer knowledge. I've yet to find a knowledgable Apple dealer, and would love it if they started a dealer education program. I know my roommate bought an Atari 800 over an Apple II about 7 years ago on this basis, and I'm sure it still affects sales today. The list goes on and on, so fill in the details and tell Apple. They need to become a consumer-oriented company if they want to make "the computer for the rest of us" and they're ignoring us, which will hurt them in the long run. So don't be shy. Since I ended this bulletin in the fashion that I did, I would like to point out that IBM has more problems than Apple does along these lines, and if you support IBM and have an attitude like my attitude towards Apple (i.e. I would really like to see them succeed but they shouldn't do it like this), then do the same thing (i.e. tell them). But it might be more effective if you posted the letters to an IBM board if they're based around IBMs. Terence Murphy tm2f+@andrew.cmu.edu Disclaimer: disclaimers are only for people with money.