Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!husc6!mit-eddie!apollo!mishkin
From: mishkin@apollo.uucp (Nathaniel Mishkin)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.wizards
Subject: Re: O'pain Software Foundation: (1) problems with AT&T
Message-ID: <3c3a23f7.13422@apollo.uucp>
Date: 23 May 88 18:15:00 GMT
References: <5412@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU> <3166@pdn.UUCP> <3c2a41f6.13422@apollo.uucp> <4628@hoptoad.uucp>
Reply-To: mishkin@apollo.UUCP (Nathaniel Mishkin)
Organization: Apollo Computer, Chelmsford, MA
Lines: 61

In article <4628@hoptoad.uucp> gnu@hoptoad.uucp (John Gilmore) writes:
>Nathaniel Mishkin wrote:
>>                                               Unifying Unix (especially
>> the BSD and System V derivative) is clearly a desirable thing.
>
>Then why are the companies that are so set upon derailing the unified
>Unix, the ones with a heavy investment in locking their customers into
>proprietary software?

On the face of it at least, the OSF is *not* trying to derail the creation
of a unified Unix.  They're just trying to unify Unix by an alternate
method that they feel is superior, clearly for themselves, but also for
the market at large.  Your statement is not so much a response as it is
a claim that AT&T and Sun have the sole authority to unify Unix and to
do so under the terms they specify.

>It's hard to believe that if half the Unix licensees refused to sign
>SVR3 licenses [due to provisions specifying that you had to ship it
>all, not just the parts you liked], that AT&T would stick with them,
>and continue to make them more heinous in future releases.

Apparently, a number of organizations and companies *have* refused to sign.
Is "half" a magic number?  Maybe other, smaller companies have been afraid
to refuse to sign for fear they'd be screwed (either intentionally or not).
Does lack of political dissent in the Soviet Union mean that everyone 
is happy?  (OK, that's ad hominem [ad corporatum?], but you get the idea.)
Anyway, it's not so hard to believe that they'd make the terms more heinous
over time.  All they have to do is wait for a couple of more releases
and get everyone hooked and then they can do whatever they damn well
please, can't they?  Are we basing corporations on wishful thinking about
competitors these days?

>>          no one other than Sun or AT&T appeared to have any opportunity
>> to have input into the process.
>
>Are you giving AT&T the opportunity to tell you how to build Apollo's Unix?
>It sounds like that was exactly what you were complaining about in the 
>"heavyweight" contract.  You won't take it, but you'd like to dish it out.

Is Apollo trying to push its version of Unix on the rest of the world?  Or
more to the point, could it?  If not, this is a non-issue.  Come back and
complain about Apollo's policies when Apollo is trying similar moves.

>>             Do end users really want to see the set of computer vendors
>> reduced because all but two are put at the disadvantage of getting the
>> latest software at a 6-12 month lag?
>
>This seems to be a bogeyman.  Motorola has already announced that the
>Unix for its 88000 will be SVR4 and that they will get early versions
>of it so that they can make a release 'in the same timeframe' as AT&T
>and Sun.

And I'm sure all the Sun & AT&T salesman will add to their pitch "And
by the way, before you make your purchasing decision, you really should
wait 6 months for our competitors to come out with exactly what we offer
right now".
-- 
                    -- Nat Mishkin
                       Apollo Computer Inc.
                       Chelmsford, MA
                       {decvax,mit-eddie,umix}!apollo!mishkin