Path: utzoo!utgpu!attcan!uunet!pdn!colin From: colin@pdn.UUCP (Colin Kendall) Newsgroups: comp.cog-eng Subject: Re: programs in cognitive science Message-ID: <3958@pdn.UUCP> Date: 4 Aug 88 11:14:05 GMT References: <536@buengc.BU.EDU> <3940@pdn.UUCP> Distribution: all Organization: Paradyne Corporation, Largo, Florida Lines: 80 In article <3940@pdn.UUCP>, reggie@pdn.UUCP (George W. Leach) writes: > In article <3939@pdn.UUCP> colin@pdn.UUCP (Colin Kendall) writes: > >In article <595@sdics.ucsd.EDU>, norman@sdics.ucsd.EDU (Donald A. Norman - danorman@ucsd.edu (or .bitnet)) writes: > >> [somebody else writes] > >> < >> <<(Sciences, > > >When I use the statement, I mean by science "systematized knowledge > >derived from observation, study, and experimentation carried on in > >order to determine the nature or principles of what is being studied". > >What's idiosyncratic or suspect about that? That is not the only > >meaning of science, of course, but it's the one the statement means. > > Colin, we must have the same dictionary! How can you state that > the definition you gave is THE one meant in that statement? Perhaps to > it is, but not to everyone. Read my lips: "When *I* use the statement, *I* mean..." It is possible that other people mean different things by "science" in the given statement; read on. > Lets examine the other definitions of the > term science: (1) the state or fact of knowing; knowledge, (3) a branch > of knowledge or study, ... > > It is simply that you choose to accept one definition of science > as the one you use for the label. Label? What label? A "discipline" is also a branch of knowledge or study. It is conceivable that the original framer of the statement, and others who cite it, meant to imply this sense of science, resulting in: "Ever notice how disciplines that have "science" in their names aren't disciplines?" But I doubt it. If I say "I like his drawings, but they are not art", I obviously mean art in the sense of beautiful things, not that the drawings are not the product of human endeavor. If I say "My baby is not a person yet", I obviously mean that my baby has not yet developed a personality, and not that the baby is not a human being. Similarly, when I say "Computer Science is not a science", I (apparently not obviously) mean that Computer Science is not a discipline that delves into the nature of computers using experiments to prove or disprove hypotheses; I do not mean that Computer Science is not a branch of knowledge or study. Get it? > Chemistry does not just concern itself > with nature, but also with synthetic creations of man using the basic > components of nature. Here you are using two senses of "chemistry" at once. Chemistry is, in one sense, the science of the composition and properties of matter, and, in another sense, the application of this science in building synthetic creations. I submit that when a chemist synthesizes something, he is acting as an engineer rather than as a scientist. > > Besides to get back on the subject at hand, cognitive science and > many of the other "soft" sciences do involve the narrow definition that > you wish to associate with the term. Well, I don't know what cognitive science is. I just thought the statement was apt with regard to the examples given by the original poster, like Food Science and Political Science, to which I add Computer Science and Library Science. I would be interested in a list of scientific disciplines with "Science" in their names. -- Colin Kendall Paradyne Corporation {uunet,peora}!pdn!colin Mail stop LF-207 Phone: (813) 530-8697 8550 Ulmerton Road, PO Box 2826 Largo, FL 33294-2826