Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!lll-winken!lll-tis!helios.ee.lbl.gov!pasteur!ucbvax!hplabs!pyramid!epimass!jbuck
From: jbuck@epimass.EPI.COM (Joe Buck)
Newsgroups: comp.mail.uucp
Subject: Re: The UUCP Project - Should it exist?
Message-ID: <2423@epimass.EPI.COM>
Date: 25 Aug 88 16:47:47 GMT
References: <935@cbnews.ATT.COM> <6858@bigtex.uucp> <1031@fig.bbn.com>
Reply-To: jbuck@epimass.EPI.COM (Joe Buck)
Organization: Entropic Processing, Inc., Cupertino, CA
Lines: 74

In comp.mail.uucp (<6858@bigtex.uucp>), james@bigtex.uucp (James Van Artsdalen) writes:
>=I have a number of problems with the blatant and unnecessary
>=commercialization of uucp domains by the UUCP Project.

In article <1031@fig.bbn.com> rsalz@bbn.com (Rich Salz) writes:
>Have you been charged, yet, a fee you consider unreasonable?

Yes.  I was recently billed $150 for the second year of the .epi.com
domain.

>If not, then why advocate the overthrow of something that basically,
>so far, works?

I had a hell of a time justifying the payment to the accounting
department, which rightly wants to pinch every penny because we're a
small company just getting out of the startup phase (or trying to).
The statements I made were of questionable validity and I won't be out
of integrity again that way, because I concentrated on the benefits of
having a registered domain and left the impression that our domain
would go away if we didn't pay.

How do you answer your accounting department when they ask the
question, "What are the consequences if we don't make this payment?"
(for renewal payments, not the first payment).

Consider:

1.  The UUCP Project provides no services to us in exchange for the
money in the second year.  Any map updates that are performed are done
for us by Erik Fair (who does Northern California) on a volunteer
basis; none of the $150 goes to him.

2.  We pay uunet to be our Internet forwarder.  We are happy with
our service from them, and they will remain as our Internet forwarder
even if the UUCP Gang deletes our map entry.  If our map entry is
deleted, we will still get mail via the Internet and uunet with
little delay; our neighbors will suffer a bit with longer paths.

(By the way, the people on the Internet who complain because their
domains aren't in the d.* files shouldn't.  Mail will get to them
faster through the top-level .com, .edu, and .org servers).

3.  The UUCP Project has no power to delete our domain.  It's
registered with SRI-NIC.

4.  If the UUCP Project starts removing sites and organizations from
the maps, (for example, if they get rid of the u.* maps or attempt
to charge).

5.  I've never seen any justification for the UUCP Project's expenses.
The only things I can think of that would make a dent in that kind of
money are:

      a) Their own computer: totally unnecessary, if you need disk
      space ask for room on uunet, which stores the maps in
      downloadable form anyway,

      b) Paid staff: again unnecessary; if the load is too tough on
      the current crew ask for more volunteers (I'd be willing to pitch
      in),

      c) Travel expenses: this would be a real outrage if we're paying
      for this.

A one-time fee for the service of setting up the domain is perfectly
appropriate.  Continuing fees are NOT.

In conclusion, I'll recommend that my company not pay any more $150
fees unless I can get a very strong justification why we should, and
I'll fight any attempt at coercion.
-- 
- Joe Buck  {uunet,ucbvax,pyramid,<smart-site>}!epimass.epi.com!jbuck
jbuck@epimass.epi.com	Old Arpa mailers: jbuck%epimass.epi.com@uunet.uu.net
	If you leave your fate in the hands of the gods, don't be 
	surprised if they have a few grins at your expense.	- Tom Robbins