Path: utzoo!utgpu!watmath!clyde!mcdchg!chinet!att!osu-cis!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!mailrus!ames!amdcad!sun!pitstop!sundc!seismo!uunet!mcvax!ukc!etive!lfcs!bct From: bct@lfcs.ed.ac.uk (Brian Tompsett) Newsgroups: comp.mail.misc Subject: Re: Mailing to the UK Summary: An attempt at correcting earlier mis-information. Message-ID: <888@etive.ed.ac.uk> Date: 27 Oct 88 15:46:41 GMT References: <2181@udccvax1.acs.udel.EDU> <6660@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu> <5692@eagle.ukc.ac.uk> <295@kl-cs.UUCP> Sender: news@etive.ed.ac.uk Reply-To: bct@ecsvax.ed.ac.uk (Brian Tompsett) Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Edinburgh University, U.K. Lines: 124 The first query that started all this was: In article <2181@udccvax1.acs.udel.EDU> brantley@vax1.acs.udel.EDU (brantley) writes: >The machine we are trying to reach is: vaxa.cc.imperial.ac.uk, this >is a Vax 8600 at Imperial College running under Vax-VMS (it might also >be on bitnet). > >The address we are currently using is: > umeed04%vaxa.cc.imperial.ac.uk@cuny.edu. First reply: In article <6660@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu> kagle@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu (Jonathan C. Kagle) writes: > ... I am also not sure if cuny.edu is a valid gateway. cunyvm.cuny.edu IS a valid internet/BITNET gateway and DOES know how to route to the UK via Rutherford Labs. >I have used Rutherford Labs with few problems. > Try: > umeed04%uk.ac.imperial.cc.vaxa@ac.uk This is only correct if the sending site is on BITNET/EARN already. This address is NOT correct from internet sites. umeed04%vaxa.cc.imperial.ac.uk@cunyvm.cuny.edu is the correct form for any site not in BITNET/EARN. > If this doesn't work, try writing to POSTMASTER at this address. >Virtually all JANET sites have a "postmaster" who can help with inquiries, >if made politely. Correct. However recent studies of all UK Postmasters have show them to be a little Tardy in responding. (i.e. time approaches infinity). > ........ (You may be missing a zero, try umeed004). No. One zero was probably OK. See later reply in this group. Second Reply: In article <5692@eagle.ukc.ac.uk> sjl@ukc.ac.uk (S.J.Leviseur) writes: > My guess is that mail will go inbound from cuny via ucl-cs. WRONG. cunyvm.cuny.edu is the Internet/BITNET gateway. It routes to the UK via Rutherford not ucl-cs. > However that is >a one way gate unless the user is authorised by ucl-cs. This means they >cannot reply to you through it unless they have filled in the forms at UCL. Perfectly correct. >An alternative route is via ukc, but we explicitly blackhole mail for that >site for funding reasons. A good reason to go via cunyvm.cuny.edu then. >That leaves bitnet, you could probably route via ukacrl and have a twoway >route. Yes. He was trying to do just that. Third reply: In article <295@kl-cs.UUCP> jonathan@cs.keele.ac.uk (Jonathan Knight) writes: >The host uk.ac.ic.cc.vaxa (aka uk.ac.imperial.cc.vaxa) >exists and accepts mail. Correct. > The address starts with uk for JANET sites but most > gateways will reverse it for you anyway. WRONG. UK gateways will mostly reverse the domains. However gateways on the US side (such as CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU) do not recognise the address in the reversed format. They need to be given in internet order (least significant end first) and not UK order (most significant end first). > The user id umeed04 does exist > as I've just mailed it with no error response Good. That deals with the question raised earlier. >Seeing as Imperial are failrly big they have probably payed up their >UkNet subscription so try this address: > ...!mcvax!ukc!umeed04@uk.ac.ic.cc.vaxa WRONG on two counts. Imperial College have not paid their UkNet subscription (according to Sean Leviseur - who should know). You cannot therefore route via ukc to imperial. Secondly the syntax is completely wrong for a route which traverses so many hosts. Each one may have a different precedence of ! and @. NEVER do it. ...!mcvax!ukc!vaxa.cc.ic.ac.uk!umeed04 would have been better syntax - or umeed04%vaxa.cc.ic.ac.uk%ukc@mcvax . Too bad it won't work. -------------- OK now some comments and some flames ------------------ Three replies to a simple request. All innacurate in some way that matters. No official replies from people who should know (like a representative of the JNT [Joint Network Team] that are responsible for JANET the UK academic network). One of the replies came from someone working at a UK gateway site - and still was mis-informed. No wonder our US friends have such trouble routing mail to us. For those overseas: The UK.AC is set up as follows: The world of USENET .-----> | ------. UUCP UUCP | | .---ukc.ac.uk------mcvax------uunet.uu.net------. ------| | ^ | Lots of | JANET | BITNET | UUCP | Sites |-----------------earn-relay.ac.uk------------PSUVAX1-' | *.ac.uk | An X.25 net | | | | | ------| | v | `--CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU----| | | CS.NET.RELAY | | | | ^ v `->The rest of EARN/BITNET | ------' | | to csnet | | | ARPA | `-nss.ucl.cs.ac.uk----------------.-------------' | v The Rest of the Arpa Internet. As you can see there is a physical link between all these UK gateways and all uk.ac sites (lets leaves uk.co and uk.mod out of this!). The only block to free flow of mail/messages are financial/administrative/authorisations. It should be possible to route from any US network to the UK. All UK gateways should have made Usenet map entries and Internet MX records for the *.ac.uk domain. Those with properly managed mailers should be able to access the UK no problem. pax brittanica. Brian. > Brian Tompsett. Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, > JCMB, The King's Buildings, Mayfield Road, EDINBURGH, EH9 3JZ, Scotland, U.K. > Telephone: +44 31 667 1081 x2711. > JANET: bct@uk.ac.ed.ecsvax ARPA: bct%ed.ecsvax@nss.cs.ucl.ac.uk