Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!ncrlnk!ncrcae!hubcap!gatech!uflorida!ukma!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!osu-cis!att!ihlpm!njd
From: njd@ihlpm.ATT.COM (DiMasi)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: Re: Was: Flight Sim II <=> XF551 incompatible forever
Message-ID: <2567@ihlpm.ATT.COM>
Date: 10 Nov 88 19:29:32 GMT
References: <1270013@hpclkms.HP.COM>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories - Naperville, Illinois
Lines: 66

> 
> / hpclkms:comp.sys.atari.8bit / cptpower@bsu-cs.UUCP (Mike Wildridge) /  5:09 pm  Nov  5, 1988 /
>>
>>Well, the 551 IS a double sided drive.  But, just as Atari did when they 
>> ....
>>ticked.
> 
> I've been told that the XF551 uses the same drive mechanism as the MS-DOS world
> does.  These drives use the index hole in the disk when they format the disk.

So do the Percom drives for Atari.  I know that I'm not the only  user
of those drives (why not? mine still work fine after 4 or 5 years, and
they are decent  single-sided,  single/double  density  drives.).   In
fact,  as  I  recall  Percom  (and  possibly others) were the first to
_market_ double-density drives for the Atari 8-bit computers.   (Atari
developed  _but never marketed_ their double- density drive.  It was a
dual drive, too.  I wonder if it was any good?)  Other makes of 8-bit
drives may or may not use the index hole when formatting; does anyone 
know about Indus, Trak, Rana, Astra, ?

> Therefore, it is not possible to flip a disk over and format the backside 
> since the index hole isn't lined up with the sensor.
> 
This is what I've been told by Bob Retelle (who  posted  an  excellent
article  here  about  the  '551),  who has tried with Percoms, too.  I
would have to get creative with a paper punch (or dig up one of  those
Nibble Notch II gadgets, that punches a write-notch and index hole for
the 2nd side).  I also found out (my ignorance is showing on this one)
that disks labelled "single sided" will usually work this way, i.e. they
are really double sided.  Perhaps they are just not "certified" to work
on the 2nd side.  (I usually find "single sided" disks are cheaper, but
then again I don't shop _everywhere_ for them.)

> This is really no a problem however, since Spartados and others will let you
> format the disk as true double sided, double density and give you 360K on
> one disk.  A much better alternative to flippy disks.

Yes, and you can still read and even write flippy disks by turning them over
as in any other 8-bit drive.  (You just can't format them, without punching
a 2nd index hole, maybe a disadvantage to an 8-bit club librarian but not 
most of us, since you can format it "true" double-sided.)
> 
> Also, I think the FSII incompatibility with the XF551 is not related to this
> problem.  It has to do with the copy protection scheme that FSII uses.  (Terry,
> am I right?  Enquiring minds want to know :-)   That's what happens when 
> software is copy protected.
> 

The 8-bit gurus on DELPHI (and I believe I saw this here too) said that the
problem with FSII indeed stems from the protection scheme:  sensitivity to
disk speed is at least part of it.  The '551 reportedly runs at about 300 rpm,
instead of the usual 288 or so for other 8-bit drives.  Does anyone have a
_definitive_ answer to the question, "will Sublogic [ever] support the '551?"
As far as other copy protection, ask me sometime what happened when I tried to
boot the first copy of Synfile+ my wife and I bought (for use with the Illinois
chapter of her professional association).  That is, if you really want to know 
:-)

> Ken Sumrall                         +-----------------------------+
> ken%hpclkms@hplabs.hp.com           |Your Kung-Fu is no good here!|
> ...!hplabs!hpclkms!ken              +-----------------------------+

Nick DiMasi        njd@ihlpm.ATT.COM     ...att!ihlpm!njd   DELPHI: TURBONICK
Uni'q Digital Technologies (Fox Valley Software subsidiary;
   ^          working as a contractor at AT&T Bell Labs in Naperville, IL)
(  | this is an accent mark, supposed to replace the dot over the 'i')