Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!ncrlnk!ncr-sd!hp-sdd!hplabs!ucbvax!RICHTER.MIT.EDU!krowitz
From: krowitz@RICHTER.MIT.EDU (David Krowitz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.apollo
Subject: Re: Huge data segments in SR10
Message-ID: <8811141531.AA00925@richter.mit.edu>
Date: 14 Nov 88 15:31:44 GMT
Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Organization: The Internet
Lines: 53

Sweet Jesus!!! You stupid SOBS AREN'T PAYING A SINGLE BIT OF
ATTENTION TO ANYTHING WE SAY! All you can come back with is a
whining bit about "vanilla Unix is just as bad ... " 
WE DIDN'T LAY OUT THE PREMIMUM BUCKS IT TAKES TO BUY AN APOLLO
SO THAT WE COULD SUFFER ALONG WITH THE REST OF THE CROWD!! IF
WE WANTED A SYSTEM THAT ACTED LIKE A VANILLA UNIX SYSTEM, WE'D
HAVE BOUGHT SUN WORKSTATIONS! We have dozens of programs which
are designed to handle the maximum case (ie. they allocate big
working arrays), but are used most of the time for much smaller
problems. When we have a large problem to process, we will roll
some files off the disk onto tape temporarily. Now we have to
keep 100MB of disk space free at all times in order to run the
small problems! Explain to me how the hell this is better than
a SUN-3!!! I have 60 (count 'em, sixty) unexperienced Fortran
programmers here, they are engaged in solving complicated
geophysical problems and they have enough work to do without
having to figure out complicated dynamic memory allocation
schemes! YOU ARE MAKING APOLLO WORKSTATIONS LESS USEFULL AND
MORE EXPENSIVE (and don't hand me the lines about your list
prices -- Apollo has constistantly removed the software which
is need to run a group of graphics workstations from the OS
and made it an optional -- and expensive -- add on).

If you had people complaining that the system would let
their job run a bit before it crashed, then why didn't you
add a switch or environment variable which would check the
disk space for them when the program was loaded rather than
removing the ability to run programs which don't necessarily
touch all of their address space every time they are run?
I write complicated print servers for a comercial customer
which require 64MB of buffers in order to handle the worst-case
printing requirements. Most of the time they can get along
just fine on 15MB, and run just fine on a machine with
20 to 30 MB of free disk space. They give an error message
when they try to touch a new page and there isn't enough
disk space. Now you tell me that when this customer wants
to upgrade to SR10, they'll have to keep 64MB of disk space
free just in order to start the print server, which means
that it won't run on a machine with a 155MB disk (take that
disk, format it, add SR10, add the VM for the required
system servers and a few pads and windows, and then see if
you can find the free disk space). What am I supposed to do?
Tell them that every printer they sell requires a $5000
disk upgrade?


 -- David Krowitz

krowitz@richter.mit.edu   (18.83.0.109)
krowitz%richter@eddie.mit.edu
krowitz%richter@athena.mit.edu
krowitz%richter.mit.edu@mitvma.bitnet
(in order of decreasing preference)