Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!lll-winken!ames!pasteur!agate!bizet.Berkeley.EDU!matloff
From: matloff@bizet.Berkeley.EDU (Norman Matloff)
Newsgroups: comp.edu
Subject: Re: The need for an advanced degree
Message-ID: <19033@agate.BERKELEY.EDU>
Date: 12 Jan 89 20:01:24 GMT
References: <8901101352.AA22246@decwrl.dec.com> <18960@agate.BERKELEY.EDU> <27198@bu-cs.BU.EDU>
Sender: usenet@agate.BERKELEY.EDU
Reply-To: matloff@iris.ucdavis.edu (Norm Matloff)
Organization: EECS, UC Davis
Lines: 44

In article <27198@bu-cs.BU.EDU> cd@bu-cs.bu.edu (Clarence K. Din) writes:

>project.  Group B has BEEN INVOLVED with group projects before; they
>know HOW TO COMPLETE A PROJECT IN TERMS OF INDUSTRY STANDARDS 

Good point!!!!  Groups A and C tend to think in terms of "partial 
credit" on examinations and projects.  E.g. they might **completely** 
miss the conceptual part of an exam problem, but still demand to get
some points simply because a "Gestalt" view of the marks on their
paper has some similarity to the correct solution.  :-)

>Group C may
>be simply a "foreign" case of Groups A or B.

Students from Taiwan, at least the male students, generally fall into
a foreign case of Group B, since they are required to serve in the
military right after getting their Bachelor's degree (and often do
technical work in the military).  This is also somewhat true for
students from China, since the government requires many of them to
work for 2 years before studying abroad.  On the other hand, students
from Hong Kong and India (the other main groups in CS grad programs
in the U.S.) generally form a foreign version of Group A.

However, all the Group C students differ from both Groups A and B
due to the immigration goal that I mentioned earlier.

>companies are probably paying for the course.  Group C needs "passing grades"
>as well, since they are usually supported by some form of tuition
>scholarship.  

Yes.  But the phrase "passing grades" is too weak, I think.  They
need TOP grades, both to attain financial support (tuition waivers,
assistantships/fellowships, etc.) while they are in school, and also
to maximize their (perceived) chances of getting a U.S. employer to
hire them and sponsor them for U.S. immigration.

>Usually, however, Group C gets the highest grades of all three.

Right.  For the above reasons, they need to do so, and are under
enormous pressure.  I don't think the Americans realize what a
tough life the foreign students lead during their times in grad
school in the U.S.

    Norm