Xref: utzoo news.sysadmin:2054 news.admin:4510 Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!lll-winken!lll-lcc!pyramid!i2ack!venta From: venta@i2ack.UUCP (Paolo Ventafridda) Newsgroups: news.sysadmin,news.admin Subject: Re: i2ack request for news/email supply connection Summary: Some explanations.. Message-ID: <102@i2ack.UUCP> Date: 20 Jan 89 01:04:38 GMT References: <1219@altger.UUCP> <361@skep2.ATT.COM> <1236@altger.UUCP> <1035@oce-rd1.oce.nl> Organization: Sublink Headquarters, Milano, Italy Lines: 96 In article <1035@oce-rd1.oce.nl>, teus@fs1-cg.oce.nl (Teus Hagen) writes: > The news costs in Europe, and students cannot afford news in Europe: > Transport of data over an ocean costs money. The way to make news available > to as many as possble readers in Europe is either sharing the (PTT) costs, > or have someone fully pay for it. The last solution: nobody has stand up > to do it (in the past DEC and Philips did it, thanks). I had written a long article about costs, and the word "sharing", but i felt it would break my "armistice" with mcvax &C., so i didn't include it. Instead, i would like to ask if it is possible to get the list of costs of EUnet, along with the one for the trafic of i2unix. > So we have the first: sharing of transport costs. > This is a very riscy situation: ie if someone does gets it cheaper via > other routes initially, and will supply others, he will cause a snowball > running of cheap intermediate news, destroy the current situation, > end finally end up in the same situation of EUnet news: more costs. Whom are you talking about? I2ack is on Usenet! It is cheaper for us to have a direct link to USA than paying i2unix! We already have News. > > So think carefully if one will try to start such connections. You didn't get the main point: EUcon is a standalone network. It has gateways on Usenet and wherever we need to go. There are a bunch of EUCON systems which are also on EUnet. Just think of EUcon as EUnet for poor people, and you'll get the idea :-) . > > At this moment the costs for news articles consists of three basics: > 1)US link costs (because of sharing the costs and cheap bulk connection the costs is > quite low) from Us to European central node. quite low? i thought they were very high. > Cost is dependent to the amount of European news subscribers. So really very low costs. Again very low costs. Uhm... > 2)costs from European central node to the national backbone. > Costs are rather low, as divided by national news subscribers. Low costs again. I think we have a different concept of what " a-lot-of-money " is. > 3)costs from national backbone to the news subscriber. This is the main costs. > You SHOULD be right.. but this should be up to the node. I mean, it's me that decide how often to poll the backbone. > What you see is that due to the large amount of subscribers costs are basically > caused by the national siruation. For i2ack it means: get as many as possible > subscribers hooked up to the national italian backbone! ..but in Italy one has to pay for the single SUBSCRIPTION a lot of $$$. Thousands of $$$. This money is spent without sending or receiving a single byte. In addition, one has to pay for the backbone transmission costs, which charges 1024 bytes 0.25 $ , PLUS an yearly additional fee for News. With the same money i buy an X.25 line and go straight to US links. Finally, one has to call its backbone, which -in our case- has a wrong PAD configuration, and allows only 1200 baud phone connections. This is it. > And your costs will be lower as they can be done now (do not expect that others will > carry your subscription costs for a longer period!). Again, i am NOT asking for a news feed in europe. You missed the sense of my message. > Or do not parasitize on European news subscribers. I don't feel like a parasite. If anyone on EUnet wants to send mail to US through us, he can do it. Anyway, my previous message meant this: we are looking for new nodes, so that we can forward mail in Europe without routing through EUnet backbones. That's it. The problem seems not to be the "transatlantic" link with uunet: EUnet wants money also for sending within its nodes. Also if nodes are willing to get the mail, to forward it etc., backbones stop it. Finally, i would like to point out that i2ack is just a node. Our network is called Sublink, and actually has half the number of nodes i2unix has. If EUnet would allow our mail coming from uunet to reach europe (as for a common bunch of nodes on Usenet), we would offer exactly the same service as i2unix, for FREE. We are not supported by anyone: if we got the money i2unix asks his nodes, i would buy a Sperry 5050 too. Greetings, Paolo -- Paolo Ventafridda Via Ottoboni 6,20148 Milano - Italy Tel.+392-4032432 EUnet:blue@altger eucon:venta@i2ack BANG:{pyramid,altger,tmpmbx}!i2ack!venta # If you mail me on i2ack, use pyramid path; i'm on eunet's lock-list..(sic) #