Xref: utzoo ont.general:853 rec.autos:18000
Path: utzoo!mnetor!tmsoft!dptcdc!ncrcan!moegate!soley
From: soley@moegate.UUCP (Norman S. Soley)
Newsgroups: ont.general,rec.autos
Subject: Re: Radar Detectors (was Highway Driving Rules)
Keywords: speed limits
Message-ID: <294@moegate.UUCP>
Date: 8 May 89 14:48:46 GMT
References: <852@mv03.ecf.toronto.edu> <9556@watcgl.waterloo.edu>
Reply-To: soley@moegate.UUCP (Norman S. Soley)
Followup-To: rec.autos
Distribution: ont
Organization: Ontario Ministry of the Environment
Lines: 79

First off I've directed follow-ups to rec.autos in the vain hope that this
"discussion" will go there and stay there. 

In article <9556@watcgl.waterloo.edu> kim@watsup.waterloo.edu (Kim Nguyen) writes:
>I am seriously annoyed by the silly 100 kph speed limit on the 401.  I
>have considered using a radar detector, but from what I've heard so
>far (if you get caught):
>
>	- the radar detector gets confiscated
>	- you get nailed with a fine for using one
>	- you get nailed for speeding
>	- you get demerit points 
>	- your insurance rates go up

All of the above. I've had the pleasure of witnessing what happens to your
confiscated radar detector (hint: it involves a sledgehammer). 

There are a number of practical reasons why you wouldn't want to bother with a 
radar detector, first off it's real easy for a cop to spot someone with a 
detector, some of the newest radar units the police have can even detect them.
Once caught with a radar detector you can bet your boots the cop will go over 
your car with a fine toothed comb looking for the slightest infraction. 
Secondly it's also pretty easy for the police to set up a radar trap that won't 
set off your detector, radar detectors rely on the fact that you can detect 
the beam long before the machine can make a reliable reading, in the modern
radar units the beam is much more tightly focused than it used to be, this 
eliminates 'phantom' readings and allows the officer to specifically pinpoint
the vehicle the reading came from, so if the radar is pointed at an angle 
across the road, or set up just after a curve in the road your radar detector
won't go off until you're already in range for a reading (this is why you'll 
often see OPP cruisers in the median at a 45 degree angle to the roadway), 
Thirdly an increasing number of the units out there only broadcast when the
officer pushes a button to take a reading, against these your detector would
only work if you got lucky and were in the path of the beam when someone else
got a reading taken. So in other words if you buy a radar detector chances are
the only thing it will do is beep when you've already been caught ($300 bucks
for a box that will beep to tell me I've lost my licence, I'll buy that)

>What have your experiences been with radar detectors?  Can police stop
>you (if you're not speeding) if they see a radar detector sitting on
>your dash? 

You bet they can, they cannot randomly stop you and search for hidden units
unless you exhibit behavior consistant with having one, but having it sitting
right out on the dash is certianly probable cause (it's too bad we don't have
laws against criminal stupidity, as that would apply too) 


I've tried to hold my tounge but don't think I can any longer so, zippo in hand
it's time to 
FLAME ON:

Ownership and operation of a radar detector is illegal, if you want to break
the law in this fashion that's between you and the officer who WILL catch you.
However it's extremely rude to say the least for you think that it's appropriate
for you to expose system owners and administrators to the potential dangers
you just have by using their systems to discuss an illegal activity, there are
laws which prohibit use of communications systems (i.e. the phone lines) for
illegal activities, although it's unlikely anyone would bother trying to enforce
them in this case, and more importantly it can adversely affect the careers or 
professional image of the system administrators. When I brought USENET into my 
organization I accepted a certian amount of risk, but I felt the benefits were 
well worth that risk, but as SA I also have the right to minimize my risk by not
carrying groups where such risk is high (like alt.drugs). You could have, 
through careful wording, asked the same question and gotten the same answers
without making it obvious that you were intending to commit a crime. You've 
now made every ont.general reader guilty of conspiracy, and I think we deserve
an apology!.

FLAME OFF:

Whew!


-- 
Norman Soley - The Communications Guy - Ontario Ministry of the Environment
Until the next maps go out:	moegate!soley@ontenv.UUCP 
if you roll your own: 	uunet!{attcan!ncrcan|mnetor!ontmoh}!ontenv!moegate!soley
I'd like to try golf but I just can't bring myself to buy a pair of plaid pants