Path: utzoo!attcan!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!apple!ames!xanth!ukma!psuvm.bitnet!cunyvm!nyser!mstr!pwa-b!philabs!linus!mbunix!bwk
From: bwk@mbunix.mitre.org (Barry W. Kort)
Newsgroups: comp.ai
Subject: Re: Free will and responsibility.
Summary: Scintillating ideas on random numbers.
Keywords: Pattern and Predictability, Quantum Amplifiers
Message-ID: <54626@linus.UUCP>
Date: 26 May 89 13:15:31 GMT
References: <10333@ihlpb.ATT.COM> <3850@uhccux.uhcc.hawaii.edu> <52019@linus.UUCP> <1309@lzfme.att.com> <1966@ucsfcca.ucsf.edu> <5
Sender: news@linus.UUCP
Reply-To: bwk@mbunix (Barry Kort)
Organization: The Gallimaufrey, Atsea, UK
Lines: 29

In article <8683@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> gpmenos@phoenix.Princeton.EDU
(G. Philippe Menos) writes:

 > Nothing is random.  The so-called "random number generator" is misnamed;
 > these devices rely on an algorithm that is based in order, though the
 > pattern is only discernable in the "long run," if it's a good generator.
 > All machines, whether human or artificial, assume a foundation in order,
 > without which only breakdown is possible.

I forgot to tell you how my random-number generator works.  I use a
scintillator which emits a flash of light when it is hit by a cosmic
ray from outer space.  I have divided the scintillator into sectors and
regions (wedge-shaped, like a pie, and annular rings, like a bulls-eye).
I color these regions, and also label them according to their
cross-sectional area.  When I want a random number, I wait for
the next cosmic ray, and note the sector in which it lands.  Sometimes
I have to wait as long as a few minutes before getting a scintillation.

 > A truly random number generator would include the possibility of not
 > generating a number at all; it might "randomly" break down and then
 > operate again.  But this wouldn't be very good for our experiments, so
 > we settle for an order that is difficult to discern.

Well, you are right.  My scintillator is not very convenient.  It
behaves a lot like your ideal random number generator.  But then
again, it does have the property that that its underlying order is
difficult to discern.

--Barry Kort